WoW: Cataclsym, anyone else bored and not feeling it ?

Nasty_Savage said:
I'm running into that issue as well, it can take HOURS to finish Z'A/Z'G due to really bad players in a random pick up. The percentage of bad is extremely high too. I find having to at least get three of my guildies on and carry the 2 pugs through just to get it done. And if they are REALLY bad, I find that if I go to boot them it frikken says 'Player can't be removed for 2 hours'. WHAT? Did I over boot people and now I can't anymore? WTF?
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I had the same issue too so now I just strictly run with guildies. I cleared ZG last night in 36 minutes. Start to finish, it was fun and easy with the guild. Just find a good guild to join and there shouldn't be a huge problem.

The game is still a load of fun (was better in wotlk imo) you just need to play with the right people. When I play with people that get pissed too easy and frustrated, it is horrid. My laid back guild members have made it a lot of fun recently.
 
WasntMe said:
The game is still a load of fun (was better in wotlk imo) you just need to play with the right people. When I play with people that get pissed too easy and frustrated, it is horrid. My laid back guild members have made it a lot of fun recently.
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I totally agree minus the wotlk part. It is all about who you play with. If you do not find a guild with quality people you will not have fun. The game is really based on having that strong guild relationship. I play with 12 other ex-hardcore raid loggers. We raid 4 to 6hrs a week, are 7/13 heroic and still having great fun getting drunk and killing internet dragons. Hell we are even about to go on a giant camping / drinking trip. So yea, if you have quality online friends this game is still alot of fun. But of course I think you can say this for all mmos.

roaf85 said:
not enough good instances like MC was minus the trash.
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Every raid since MC has been better than MC I dont know what you are talking about. The fights in MC where just too simple.
 
xenios said:
Every raid since MC has been better than MC I dont know what you are talking about. The fights in MC where just too simple.
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MC was horrid....The trash was often more difficult than the bosses. Boss mechanics were relatively simple. And the damn bindings never dropped for my guild, though 3 other guilds on horde side had multiple bindings and Thunderfurrys.
 
zoobaby said:
MC was horrid....The trash was often more difficult than the bosses. Boss mechanics were relatively simple. And the damn bindings never dropped for my guild, though 3 other guilds on horde side had multiple bindings and Thunderfurrys.
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We never had a problem with the trash pulls. By the end of vanilla WoW we were full clearing MC for DE's in less than an hour.
 
DyNamiC. said:
We never had a problem with the trash pulls. By the end of vanilla WoW we were full clearing MC for DE's in less than an hour.
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I call bullshit on no issues with trash, unless you joined a guild that had it farm already. Early on, the FR gear needed was a PITA to get and the flame packs would just crush people without it.

But yeah by the end of vanilla, we along with about every other raiding guild were clearing MC and BWL on the same night, wasn't that big of an accomplishment. Hell, we were largely clearing MC with ~20 people while waiting for people to log in for BWL.
 
You can call BS all you want. A bit of FR gear combined with the FR buff from BRS made it pretty simple once we learned how to pull and handle the fights. I'm not going to say we never died or wiped from them but it didn't take long before that stopped.

We were easily the top guild on our server in vanilla WoW. If people couldn't gear themselves or follow directions we didn't need you.
 
I still stand by the notion that MC was pretty fun minus the trash. The mechanics while not super difficult were different on every fight and unique. Plus the gear you got from each boss was worthwhile.
 
Disposed said:
As someone who has been buying and selling game accounts for over 10 years i call bullshit on both claims. Wow ended the days of accounts being worth thousands, the only places that try and sell for that much are the gold farmer sites. You have a $500 account at most.

If someone offered you 2500 you should have taken it because that would have gotten you an account better than yours and $2k to spare.

Of course there are always idiots with too much money but accounts are just not worth that much these days.
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I dont want another account, and i got offered that because of my Teir 3 and my lvl 60 mounts that are no longer attainable, and the fact there is a 150,000 gold on the account. Some people will stay pay alot for some of the special stuff that you can no longer attain in game post cataclysm don't ask me why but when cata came out the value of ZG gear/mounts. And ZA gear/Mount went up in value, similar to how it did when WoLK made my Teir 3 valuable overnight all the sudden,.
 
I've played World of Warcraft since less than a year after it's release and I'm on the fence now about renewing my subscription.

I liked the heroics in Wotlk not because they were easy but because they didn't consume massive amounts of time. It's fun to be able to run a heroic and not have to worry if you really have 2 free hours to spare...

Heroics now take so much time to complete that I have to plan my schedule around doing them, as if it was a 5-man raid or something.

I want to be able to go into a heroic and get it done in less than 45 minutes, preferably more like half an hour. At least less than 60 minutes so I only have to use one flask...

I don't care if the content is difficult, and I don't mind investing lots of time into the game overall, I just can't randomly devote 2+ hour long blocks of time to running a heroic at random times of day - but running heroics at random times of day used to be one of my favorite things to do.

My job, I'm basically "on-call". That means on any given day I'm not doing anything, but could be called at any time. That sucks if I get a call 15 minutes into a 2 hour heroic whereas in wrath I'd probably have time to finish it quickly before I had to leave.

The fact that my main is a Resto Druid and healing is still way nerfed compared to Wotlk doesn't help my motivation to play either. In PvE there is now a smaller window of opportunity between "this person is taking so much damage nothing you do will save them" and "everyone is doing what they are supposed to so you can basically fall asleep". An individual healer is now much less likely to be able to pull a group through errors and thus, especially with pugs, it just feels like I'm now at the mercy of idiots.
 
GotNoRice said:
I've played World of Warcraft since less than a year after it's release and I'm on the fence now about renewing my subscription.

I liked the heroics in Wotlk not because they were easy but because they didn't consume massive amounts of time. It's fun to be able to run a heroic and not have to worry if you really have 2 free hours to spare...

Heroics now take so much time to complete that I have to plan my schedule around doing them, as if it was a 5-man raid or something.

I want to be able to go into a heroic and get it done in less than 45 minutes, preferably more like half an hour. At least less than 60 minutes so I only have to use one flask...

I don't care if the content is difficult, and I don't mind investing lots of time into the game overall, I just can't randomly devote 2+ hour long blocks of time to running a heroic at random times of day - but running heroics at random times of day used to be one of my favorite things to do.

My job, I'm basically "on-call". That means on any given day I'm not doing anything, but could be called at any time. That sucks if I get a call 15 minutes into a 2 hour heroic whereas in wrath I'd probably have time to finish it quickly before I had to leave.

The fact that my main is a Resto Druid and healing is still way nerfed compared to Wotlk doesn't help my motivation to play either. In PvE there is now a smaller window of opportunity between "this person is taking so much damage nothing you do will save them" and "everyone is doing what they are supposed to so you can basically fall asleep". An individual healer is now much less likely to be able to pull a group through errors and thus, especially with pugs, it just feels like I'm now at the mercy of idiots.
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run the Cata release heroics they can be cleared in 45 minutes or less, the new ones yea take time, and often if a wipe happens on a boss they disban, but its the WOLK mindset, also WOLK killed the community. I started in 2005 playing wow, and in Classic and TBC people didn't expect to one shot the boss's I mean we did BRD and we sometimes didnt even finish, or in TBC we needed a specific comp to finish a heroic, but in WOLK it handed loot to you and made it trivial, you didnt have to work for anything. Then Cata went back to making you learn and the community can't handle that. The hardcore do heorics but in guild groups what you get is casuals, yes my guild can clear ZA or ZG in 40-50 minutes for ZG and ZA in 25-30 but where also clearing heroics and we work together, good luck in randoms with the casual playbase.
 
insaneshell said:
run the Cata release heroics they can be cleared in 45 minutes or less, the new ones yea take time
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I didn't mean to imply that I'm not familiar with the current crop of heroics or that I haven't gone through them, I have, a number of times.

But even with the "cata release" heroics, people are always doing randoms for points, and you have no idea what you are going to get until you're already committed. Something like a "Lost City of the Tol'vir" run is quick enough, but something like a Grim Batol or a Stonecore is very often a hour+ annoying run where you cycle through maybe a dozen pugs over the course of the run.

I started in 2005 playing wow, and in Classic and TBC people didn't expect to one shot the boss's I mean we did BRD and we sometimes didnt even finish, or in TBC we needed a specific comp to finish a heroic, but in WOLK it handed loot to you and made it trivial, you didnt have to work for anything.
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But the framework of the game was different back then also.

In TBC, The only "points" you had were Badges of Justice. You could get these just by farming the easier heroics if you wanted. There was a daily heroic quest that gave you more badges, but it told you up front which dungeon it was for.

So unlike today you don't have a bunch of pugs in your stonecore or whatever that can't actually handle it, but are just trying to get their random done.

TBC also required a heroic key to do a dungeon on heroic mode, which first required you to gain rep with that faction, typically by doing the dungeon first on normal mode many times.

It's not like today where people assume they can handle the dungeon simply because it allows them to queue for it.

So you ended up in a situation where, for the most part, the people attempting the harder dungeons where the ones who actually needed loot from there, not just because a random dungeon finder stuck them in there.

good luck in randoms with the casual playbase.
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But isn't that the problem? "Casual" players make up the majority of the playerbase. If you have to be a hardcore player to have fun, the game is going to die.

But even casuals can usually put up with wiping a few times. It's that, "we just wiped 3 times and we still have an hour+ left to go in this instance" that really causes people to leave. With the dungeons taking so much time now to complete, anything other than a nearly flawless run is going to take a prohibitively long time to complete.
 
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GotNoRice said:
I didn't mean to imply that I'm not familiar with the current crop of heroics or that I haven't gone through them, I have, a number of times.

But even with the "cata release" heroics, people are always doing randoms for points, and you have no idea what you are going to get until you're already committed. Something like a "Lost City of the Tol'vir" run is quick enough, but something like a Grim Batol or a Stonecore is very often a hour+ annoying run where you cycle through maybe a dozen pugs over the course of the run.



But the framework of the game was different back then also.

In TBC, The only "points" you had were Badges of Justice. You could get these just by farming the easier heroics if you wanted. There was a daily heroic quest that gave you more badges, but it told you up front which dungeon it was for.

So unlike today you don't have a bunch of pugs in your stonecore or whatever that can't actually handle it, but are just trying to get their random done.

TBC also required a heroic key to do a dungeon on heroic mode, which first required you to gain rep with that faction, typically by doing the dungeon first on normal mode many times.

It's not like today where people assume they can handle the dungeon simply because it allows them to queue for it.

So you ended up in a situation where, for the most part, the people attempting the harder dungeons where the ones who actually needed loot from there, not just because a random dungeon finder stuck them in there.



But isn't that the problem? "Casual" players make up the majority of the playerbase. If you have to be a hardcore player to have fun, the game is going to die.

But even casuals can usually put up with wiping a few times. It's that, "we just wiped 3 times and we still have an hour+ left to go in this instance" that really causes people to leave. With the dungeons taking so much time now to complete, anything other than a nearly flawless run is going to take a prohibitively long time to complete.
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well I've got to ask a question in classic and TBC if you where a casual you did some of the harder dungeons when you had the time. But unless you where a raider you didn't need the gear per say. WoLK made it so everyone had to be in epic raid gear, not because the content required it, "I did the ICC 5 mans in i178 blues and ICC 10m Normal on my Hunter in 178 blues" it was just that they handed them out. So if you dont raid why do you need valor points, run regs they give Justice points now, and if you don't raid you dont need the purps. WoLK just spoiled people. Think of it this way in Classic getting your dungeon set from BRD, Strat, Scholo and BRS, each dungeon in Preraid gear took 2-3 hours to do, in Teir 1 about an hour, Teir 2, about 40 minutes, and AQ40/Tier3 it was a joke of course. TBC most heroics and dungeons except for a very few took an hour to do. Even WoLK heroics at launch in greens/blues could take time, I remember taking over an hour my first Heroic nexus, yea when I was in i245 gear i could power clear it in 10 minutes. What you have to realize is Blizzard doesn't want to make the content trivial and a joke and wants you to work for that gear you want now. Might I suggest instead if you want purps to find a pug doing the first boss's of BWD, and BOT, the first 2 boss's in each are cake walk and raiders who pug are usually smarter lol. Or look for a guild filling in for a missing player, on our 25man nights we sometimes are down 1-3 people and take trade pugs that have at least i350 which is easy to attain.

But in randoms pray and hope sometimes we do release heroics for alts gearing up, someones alt + 3 of the raid toons, and often times a pug from LFD. Hope for that team of people wearing heroic raid gear lol. We will carry you. We did GB last night in i think 21 minutes lol
 
insaneshell said:
run the Cata release heroics they can be cleared in 45 minutes or less, the new ones yea take time, and often if a wipe happens on a boss they disban, but its the WOLK mindset, also WOLK killed the community. I started in 2005 playing wow, and in Classic and TBC people didn't expect to one shot the boss's I mean we did BRD and we sometimes didnt even finish, or in TBC we needed a specific comp to finish a heroic, but in WOLK it handed loot to you and made it trivial, you didnt have to work for anything. Then Cata went back to making you learn and the community can't handle that. The hardcore do heorics but in guild groups what you get is casuals, yes my guild can clear ZA or ZG in 40-50 minutes for ZG and ZA in 25-30 but where also clearing heroics and we work together, good luck in randoms with the casual playbase.
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Casual doesn't necessarily mean bad. Casual just means that the person doesn't play often. Some of the fellas I raid with don't ever log on other than for our raids, but they are pretty amazing at doing what they do.

But I get what you mean. Good luck using LFD to try to finish ZA/ZG :mad:
 
I'm hoping Firelands comes out soon. I am so bored of doing the 12/12 my guild does every week with 5/13 heroics throw in through out the night. My guild has the majority of the heroic gear available in slots from those 5 bosses on each of our toons but there's always a few ppl not following mechanics that get themselves killed. Its frustrating because we've been at 5/13 for probably 3 months and I don't see us progressing much further without replacing people but were a 'laid back, friendly' guild. At least firelands gives us something new and potentially we can get ilvl 378? gear from doing our random heroics, attempting fireland bosses and going back and doing T11 hardmodes we can already clear. Preferably some of the other 8/13 we haven't finished too! Just to get VP capped each week and watch all our hard work in heroic modes go to waste...as casual players in hdungeons wearing ilvl359 gear get rewarded with better gear than I did from raiding heroic modes...Sigh. Why am I playing this rat-wheel game again? haha.

My main concern though lies in what a lot of other people having been saying. When doing Random Heroics, I play a healer and I am at the mercy of how badly geared the tank is, how badly skilled the tank is or how extremely low the dps can be. As a Pally Healer in ilvl 363 gear level equipped, I don't really go oom so low dps is never a whipe but its awful when a boss battle takes 15 minutes and your like ...'WTheck? Should I be smiting this creature to death? or auto attacking more'.

Sadly, with Paladin healers, in the next patch basically the mana cost of all our spells are going up by 20-30% and our healing output is being decreased when at the moment, a well geared shaman/druid healer pulls equal numbers to us in a lot of raid situations. We are also being punished for using our 'large tank heal' spell DL too much so the mana cost is greatly increase, efficiency decreasing and were being told to use holy light more often which isn't enough to keep a tank alive to begin with. Goooo Blizzard! So Pally Healers lose our effeciency as tank healers which removes one of our only roles in a raid. .... /sigh.

Go Cataclsym.... The more I raid heroic raids, the more gear I get that'll be replaced by h-dungeon rewards come patch 4.2. Anyone else think they should have put the h-dungeon rewards like 1-2 lvls less than the heroic raid rewards and then put fireland's normal to be a moderate increase? and heroic another moderate increase again? Perhaps adding a new currency type for fireland roics?
 
WBurchnall said:
Anyone else think they should have put the h-dungeon rewards like 1-2 lvls less than the heroic raid rewards and then put fireland's normal to be a moderate increase? and heroic another moderate increase again?
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I thought that is very close to what is going to happen.

raiding points are getting converted to heroic points.
existing gear that costs raid points will cost heroic points. Gear that cost tokens is not changing the token cost.
new raiding point gear is being added.
existing normal raids are being nerfed and point rewards are converted to heroic points.
Existing heroic raids may continue to reward heroic points (they aren't getting nerfed, but I'm not sure on the point type).

I think it creates a nice avenue to open up content to PUG raids and makes a new set of gear available to somebody who only does 5 man dungeons. Since the token costs aren't changing it won't be possible to get the absolute best gear without clearing the raids in heroic mode. In any case it's made me consider buying cata and subbing for a month or to in order to clear the existing raids in normal mode. Then I can resub for a month every time a new raid comes out if they continue with the model.
 
Having a combat Rogue as a main I can safely say I'm done with WoW for now. Mediocre DPS w/ poor target switching burst, raid fights that favor range heavy comps (good luck getting a spot in a 10man), and the fact that Blizz balances around PvP more then PvE these days.

Not to mention that Killing Spree is one of the worst 31 talent point abilities in the game and Blizz still took it upon themselves to nerf it's damage % done in Cata.
 
Mozex said:
I thought that is very close to what is going to happen.

raiding points are getting converted to heroic points.
existing gear that costs raid points will cost heroic points. Gear that cost tokens is not changing the token cost.
new raiding point gear is being added.
existing normal raids are being nerfed and point rewards are converted to heroic points.
Existing heroic raids may continue to reward heroic points (they aren't getting nerfed, but I'm not sure on the point type).

I think it creates a nice avenue to open up content to PUG raids and makes a new set of gear available to somebody who only does 5 man dungeons. Since the token costs aren't changing it won't be possible to get the absolute best gear without clearing the raids in heroic mode. In any case it's made me consider buying cata and subbing for a month or to in order to clear the existing raids in normal mode. Then I can resub for a month every time a new raid comes out if they continue with the model.
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This is correct. Valor points will be converted to justice points. Heroic 5mans still only give valor the 7 times a week. The 359 gear will now require justice point rather than valor. Current normal raids are getting nerfed and will reward justice points. Currert heroic raid will not be nerfed and will reward valor points.These changes are there to prevent you from cheesing the points, and also to help gear newer players to a firelands ready baseline. So no you wont be replacing your heroic gear by doing heroic dungeons (Other than the points you get every week).

Should heroic gear from a tier ago be higher ilevel than regular gear from a new tier? no. Heroics are there for the extra challenge (which is definitely there) and to give you a leg up on that content. To add to that, does it even matter? If you are in a heroic level guild you will be done with normal mode in a matter of weeks if you don't suck.
 
I just canceled my wow account, my wifes account and my brother inlaws. WOW just isn't fun any more. My job doesnt give me a good time to raid any more. The pug's now days are worthless. People can't play for shit any more. Almost every LFG my tank is doing half the dps of the group. I have just giving up on trying to play it any more. I have an 85 of every class. I work from home so, I might just be burned out on it. But I dont think they should have went from easy wow back to hard wow. They should have went easy wow then medium. You have all these noobs that think they can play because they were good in WOTLK. Now there bottom of the barrel. Like othere's have said if your not in a fun guild it's just not worth playing any more. I miss my old guild. Feel apart right before cata came out. Now people are just in guilds to get the guild benafits. Guild im in now no one ever talks there just there because its a high lvl guild. Id transfer to a friends sever but it would cost me an arm and a leg. I just give up. Just going to wait on Star wars and hope its good. Or diablo 3 then ill really have no life lol.
 
Makeroflostsouls said:
I just canceled my wow account, my wifes account and my brother inlaws. WOW just isn't fun any more. My job doesnt give me a good time to raid any more. The pug's now days are worthless. People can't play for shit any more. Almost every LFG my tank is doing half the dps of the group. I have just giving up on trying to play it any more. I have an 85 of every class. I work from home so, I might just be burned out on it. But I dont think they should have went from easy wow back to hard wow. They should have went easy wow then medium. You have all these noobs that think they can play because they were good in WOTLK. Now there bottom of the barrel. Like othere's have said if your not in a fun guild it's just not worth playing any more. I miss my old guild. Feel apart right before cata came out. Now people are just in guilds to get the guild benafits. Guild im in now no one ever talks there just there because its a high lvl guild. Id transfer to a friends sever but it would cost me an arm and a leg. I just give up. Just going to wait on Star wars and hope its good. Or diablo 3 then ill really have no life lol.
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I'm taking a break from MMORPG's for now. I quit WoW back in February to play Rift. In the end, they're all the same, though. I plan to sit it out until SWTOR.
 
MC is a very fun raid and a good introduction to raiding. The sheer size of all the enemies made it feel really epic, the trash was dangerous to individuals but the raid rarely wiped on it and the bosses were simple.
 
Valshistixol said:
I don't think some people remember the hours of MC trash pulls.
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I remember my very first time in MC. It was my guilds first time. I was the best geared - decked out in PVP rep gear, couple pieces of Valor, dungeon blues and rocking an Arcanite Reaper. We wiped horribly on our first pull. Good times!
My favorite raid was BWL. AQ40 was ok (I loved the Twin Emps). Naxx was a nightmare - it was stupid hard.
God, I'm glad I got married and don't have time for that crap anymore. We raided four nights a week, 4 hours a night - extra if the world bosses were up.
 
Valshistixol said:
I don't think some people remember the hours of MC trash pulls.
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AQ had much more trash than MC but people still regard it very highly. Maybe it's only because they didn't raid AQ every seven days for three years trying to get Thunderfurys.

It was a bad design decision by Blizzard to put the best tanking weapon available in vanilla in the first raid and give it a crazy low drop rate.
 
Would love to see recent subscription numbers, there has to be a drop off. I think he height of WoW was with Wrath at 12 million, there is no way they are still up there, so many people on my server have left the game, and all my RL family and friends quit the game this past Spring. Reading forums, a lot of players just got bored quickly with Cataclysm.

It is just the same old, same old...six years +, and it has hit the wall.
 
Zorachus said:
Would love to see recent subscription numbers, there has to be a drop off. I think he height of WoW was with Wrath at 12 million, there is no way they are still up there, so many people on my server have left the game, and all my RL family and friends quit the game this past Spring. Reading forums, a lot of players just got bored quickly with Cataclysm.

It is just the same old, same old...six years +, and it has hit the wall.
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We do know that between December and March Blizzard lost 600,000 subscriptions.
 
Cataclysm is just more of the same old, and there's been way too much rehashing for it to be this early in the expansion.

edit: Geez time goes by fast. I guess it's not really "early" anymore.
 
I logged into Cataclysm at midnight on launch, got server first fishing, then spent the next 3 weeks or so doing dailies and a dungeon here and there and promptly cancelled my account. January 2005 - January 2011. Movin' on, movin' on...
 
Mozex said:
AQ had much more trash than MC but people still regard it very highly. Maybe it's only because they didn't raid AQ every seven days for three years trying to get Thunderfurys.

It was a bad design decision by Blizzard to put the best tanking weapon available in vanilla in the first raid and give it a crazy low drop rate.
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Almost everyone I knew hated AQ. I loved it. I loved AQ20 and AQ40. Was such a nice change from the MC/BWL.

Totally agree with the Thunderfury. Like I said, my guild never got a binding. While 3 other guilds, same faction and server, had multiple - I cried when one their hunters got it - and cried even more when I found out he got both bindings in the same run.

I guess the one thing that stands out from Vanilla WoW to Cata, in Vanilla you had to have resist sets to raid. MC everyone needed some FR. BWL FR helped, but Ony cloak mandatory (throne glitch exception), and NR for AQ. I remember farming Mara over and over to get NR gear for people.
 
GregP24 said:
We do know that between December and March Blizzard lost 600,000 subscriptions.
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Thanks, but I would think the numbers starting in like April or so would be more telling. By April everyone have had time to play Cataclsym, and would be a bigger drop off of subscribers.

I had a great time playing WoW the last six years, but to me it's time has come and gone, the best time for me were the middle years, like end of TBC and early Wrath, those couple years were a blast for me. But I will give patch 4.2 a solid try, that will be my last attempt at staying with WoW. When is 4.2 due ?
 
A "release" patch is up on the public test realm. Normally that means less than two weeks; ie. they will release the current PTR build unless they find something wrong with it.
 
Zorachus said:
Thanks, but I would think the numbers starting in like April or so would be more telling. By April everyone have had time to play Cataclsym, and would be a bigger drop off of subscribers.

I had a great time playing WoW the last six years, but to me it's time has come and gone, the best time for me were the middle years, like end of TBC and early Wrath, those couple years were a blast for me. But I will give patch 4.2 a solid try, that will be my last attempt at staying with WoW. When is 4.2 due ?
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I am with you, its more or less a hold over til the good games by the end of the year show up.
 
The loss of 600,000 doesn't really scream "PROBLEM!!!" to me.

Yes, WoW is beginning to decline, but its to be expected. The game has been out for six and a half years, a great run for any MMO. It's not over yet, but I'm pretty sure even Blizzard is preparing to wrap things up pretty soon.

Still, I don't find many glaring problems in the state of the game today. Read posts from people who have quit and you will find that nearly all of them share a similar reasoning: "this game is just the same thing over and over again, all you do is raid and pvp to get better gear then wait for a new tier, etc. etc. etc." Sounds like the way any MMO is, really. Of course people are going to get bored. You don't have one job for your entire life, you're going to move around (hopefully).

Although the subscription numbers have dropped off, I don't think its a reflection on how the game is itself. To say "oh they lost 600,000 people that means this game sucks now" is not necessarily true. Now, I'm not saying that the game hasn't changed, because it has. It's definitely not as casual-friendly as WotLK was, and that frustrates a lot of people (probably the people that quit), but the increased challenge has also been greatly welcomed by many players. It just so happens that those who are unsatisfied with the game are more vocal than those who are satisfied with.

Pretty sure MW2 outsold BC2 by a large amount, but I'm also pretty sure that most people on these forums would prefer BC2 any day. It's all about your target demographic. Justin Bieber might have hordes of teenage girls buying his CDs but that doesn't mean the music he is making is any good (not trying to hate, the kid can really sing, but his songs suck)
 
Love the WoW reference in Duke Nukem Forever.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vYifHBssi9Q"]YouTube - ‪Duke Nukem Forever - World of Warcraft Reference‬‏[/ame]

LOL.
 
4.2 trailer

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HsXglDs81FU"]YouTube - ‪Cataclysm - Patch 4.2: Rage of the Firelands‬‏[/ame]
 
xenios said:
4.2 trailer

YouTube - ‪Cataclysm - Patch 4.2: Rage of the Firelands‬‏
Click to expand...

Not nearly as exciting as the Black Temple trailer, 'BC's Troll' raid trailer or ICC's trailer. It was a bit boring and as I was watching the boss fights I couldn't help but think man that looks lame/bored/ugly. What bad models and downright awful graphics. Even the end-boss of firelands just looks like a slightly larger sized fire elemental model....

I can't believe people have been grinding the same boring 13-bosses in cataclysm for almost a year and all they get is .... this small patch of a few boring looking bosses. :eek:

Not to mention, they are screwing over healers again by upping the cost of every spell os our 'mana regen' doesn't get to high. Aka across the board nerfs to prevent over-gearing causing near oomless healers. Albiet; makes the new gear feel worthless when it just gets you back to Patch 4.1's gear effectiveness. Its like your re-grinding for the same tier.
 
WBurchnall said:
makes the new gear feel worthless when it just gets you back to Patch 4.1's gear effectiveness. Its like your re-grinding for the same tier.
Click to expand...

That's Blizzard's super effective penny-saving strategy. Don't allow any meaningful progression. Just give the illusion of progression. Why have two raids when you can make people clear the same set of bosses twice? Why allow player characters to progress and become more powerful when you can simply re-calibrate every tier?
 
With the amount of nerfs the 4.2 patch is going to fail.... not.
But people are definitely getting bored. Smaller raid sizes let to a lot of big guilds breaking up into smaller because A/B raid teams. A team does not talk to B any longer, things fall apart, people quit. Meh.
 
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