Windows Phone And Blackberry Head For Extinction

Megalith

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With iOS and Android combining for a record 99.1% worldwide market share in the second calendar quarter of 2016, things look grave for Microsoft and Blackberry, which see drops from 2.5 and 0.3 percent to 0.6 and 0.1 percent.

In real terms, shipments of Windows Phone devices stood at 1.97 million for the quarter, with BlackBerry at 400,000. Compare this to the 44.4 million iOS devices or 296.9 million Android smartphones shipped during the same period, and you see just how bad it is. Essentially both Windows Phone and BlackBerry are headed for extinction. It's not a matter of if this is going to happen, but when. This has some serious repercussions for the mobile arena.
 

Quartz-1

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This is seriously bad news for Microsoft. It's only a matter of time before Android becomes competitive in the desktop and thus business sectors.
 

Bigbacon

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This is seriously bad news for Microsoft. It's only a matter of time before Android becomes competitive in the desktop and thus business sectors.

not really news for microsoft. WIndows Phone has been dying since it forever. I am amazed they actually pushed 10 mobile as it isn't even that good and I prefer 8.1 over it. Sad thing is the platform is really good it just has that "no app" stigma, which while true, it does have most of the major stuff.

I do love my windows phone. I am REALLY hoping surface phones do come out and reignite something for MS.
 

heatlesssun

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not really news for microsoft. WIndows Phone has been dying since it forever. I am amazed they actually pushed 10 mobile as it isn't even that good and I prefer 8.1 over it. Sad thing is the platform is really good it just has that "no app" stigma, which while true, it does have most of the major stuff.

I do love my windows phone. I am REALLY hoping surface phones do come out and reignite something for MS.

Yeah, Microsoft is priced as being out of the mobile client market. They've made up for it in other areas to a large extent. I don't see Android as being any more of a desktop threat than desktop Linux for the intermediate future at least.
 

pxc

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This is seriously bad news for Microsoft. It's only a matter of time before Android becomes competitive in the desktop and thus business sectors.
MS faces threats, but not really from Android. MS makes money from business licenses and selling services. Android isn't a threat to corporate/enterprise desktop computing. While some types of applications can be converted to run through a browser or other thin client interface, many applications cannot. Windows is very entrenched into corporate desktops and even if Chrome OS or Android made a significantly superior desktop experience, it would take a very long time for a platform migration.

It's hard to tell what's going to happen in the longer term. With the W10 strategy (based on a magnificently flawed tablet/phone/desktop convergence plan), I think MS will eventually run out of executive feet to shoot and start failing unless it makes a more reasonable change in direction to consider its core business.
 

Quartz-1

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. I don't see Android as being any more of a desktop threat than desktop Linux for the intermediate future at least.

I've got to disagree. Put a Displayport or HDMI port on your mobile and hook up a monitor, pair a mouse and keyboard via Bluetooth, connect to your wifi, and you've got a perfectly capable workstation. Or plug your mobile into a docking station that already has everything connected.
 

heatlesssun

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I've got to disagree. Put a Displayport or HDMI port on your mobile and hook up a monitor, pair a mouse and keyboard via Bluetooth, connect to your wifi, and you've got a perfectly capable workstation. Or plug your mobile into a docking station that already has everything connected.

I can do this with my Lumia 950 and while it's actually practical I don't know how much of a replacement it would be for a laptop of desktop. For people that do basic tasks it's certainly possible. However convergence like this might play better for Microsoft since they are pretty well ahead in that game. I think scaling up to desktop capabilities is a bit harder than scaling down to phones and tablets.
 

NoXiN

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I had a Z10 backberry for work. it was actually a pretty good phone.
 

sadsteve

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I've got to disagree. Put a Displayport or HDMI port on your mobile and hook up a monitor, pair a mouse and keyboard via Bluetooth, connect to your wifi, and you've got a perfectly capable workstation. Or plug your mobile into a docking station that already has everything connected.

Gonna be rather slow on those large project compiles, video/photo editing, etc. For just email, browsing and light weight document generation it would probably work.
 

Ur_Mom

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Microsoft didn't care about the mobile phones. They didn't care about poor carrier support, they didn't bring out flagship devices, the OS was slow and they didn't make it a priority. It was always going to die.

Excellent OS, good phones. Just nothing to blow away the competition. I'd love a Surface Phone. The newer AT&T models were nice, but limited to the single carrier. WP10 was buggy, slow. It looked great and had some great features.

WP was excellent. Just lack of confidence from Microsoft and support from them, third parties and carriers....
 

ChadD

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Well blackberry is already an assisted suicide situation. Blackberry is transitioning to life as an Android supplier.

This is pretty terrible if not unexpected news for MS.

As others have said... if MS doesn't do something drastic in the next 2-3 years, they will have to transition to making third rate software ala Corel. ;)

Google is working on their own Kernal right now... and anyone that believes their only intention with that project is integrated stuffs isn't really thinking. At some point in the next few years, Google is going to rebrand Android and kill ChromeOS. The new "android" will use their new non linux kernal, and run on pretty much anything. If MS doesn't make the right moves with in a few years new Android will be the defacto OS on everything but servers, which MS has already all but lost to linux anyway.
 

joblo37pam

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WP was excellent. Just lack of confidence from Microsoft and support from them, third parties and carriers....


I recently switched from Win 8.1 to Android 6.x as my Lumia 822 was getting old and slow. I miss my old phone. It's nice having access to some of the Android apps that I couldn't run before, but I'd be happier if things worked as well as my Windows phone. Outlook for Android doesn't support Exchange tasks, Skype for Business and Outlook notifications show up late (if at all), texts aren't read when connected to BT, etc. Nothing huge, but annoying.
 

DrLobotomy

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I like my cheap Lumia 521. Hopefully someone will continue making a Winphone if it isn't MS. If not, I have no clue what a decent cheap smartphone is. I refuse to own anything Apple so I guess I will have to find a Linux phone.
 

ManofGod

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I like my cheap Lumia 521. Hopefully someone will continue making a Winphone if it isn't MS. If not, I have no clue what a decent cheap smartphone is. I refuse to own anything Apple so I guess I will have to find a Linux phone.

Cheap is not Apple's mantra anyways which I why I do not own one. (I like the iPhone 6 plus but, even used prices are outrageous for me.) Just look on Amazon for a decent used LG G4 or G5 if you need too. I am on an HTC One M8 for Windows with 10 Mobile on it and am quite content. As long as Microsoft supports Windows 10 Mobile, I will continue to use it. However, I am on Verizon until my contract is up next February so even though I want a 950 or 950XL, I cannot use one until I get off of Verizon.
 

dgingeri

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The drop in Mircosoft share is probably exclusively because they haven't released models for large portions of the market. They have a $140 model, a $200 model, and then a jump all the way up to the $500 model. They also only cover one carrier currently, AT&T. They have one model, almost two years old, for Verison, and no models that work with T-mobile or Sprint. Alcatel has a model for T-mobile, but it is not even known by most people. Couple that with a severe slowdown of app development for the platform, probably due to the lack of current models, and you get a collapsing brand.
 

kohl

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I was a Windows Phone holdout until very recently. I had a Lumia and loved it. Unfortunately, my device was not slated to receive the Win10 upgrade, and Verizon was not offering any devices :( I was willing to hold out for the Surface Phone but with no solid info on release dates I caved and went with a Galaxy S7 Edge, which I am happy with.
 

InorganicMatter

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RIM survives right now by monetizing their patents. They're making good money for the time being, but it's not a sustainable long-term business practice, given that patents only last for so long. They will probably remain around longer than most here expect, but will quickly go away after they've milked their portfolio dry.
 

ZenDragon

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not really news for microsoft. WIndows Phone has been dying since it forever. I am amazed they actually pushed 10 mobile as it isn't even that good and I prefer 8.1 over it. Sad thing is the platform is really good it just has that "no app" stigma, which while true, it does have most of the major stuff.

I do love my windows phone. I am REALLY hoping surface phones do come out and reignite something for MS.

I'm with you man. I loved my windows phone, the interface is FAR superior to android (without heavy customization). Problem, as you mentioned is the lack of apps. Every major app I personally used on a daily basis was slowly being taken away. First my two banking apps, one is online so I could no longer deposit checks with my phone. Then amazon pulled its app. It just kept getting worse.

I switched back to android, and immediately became frustrated and hated it. But at least I can do all my shit again. *sigh*
 

thejokker

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I've got to disagree. Put a Displayport or HDMI port on your mobile and hook up a monitor, pair a mouse and keyboard via Bluetooth, connect to your wifi, and you've got a perfectly capable workstation. Or plug your mobile into a docking station that already has everything connected.
Wrong... Hardware doesn't get work done; Software gets it done. Just as you cannot play Doom on an Android you cannot run Office, Quickbooks or AutoCad.
 
D

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Wrong... Hardware doesn't get work done; Software gets it done. Just as you cannot play Doom on an Android you cannot run Office, Quickbooks or AutoCad.



Microsoft Office Mobile - Android Apps on Google Play

QuickBooks Accounting+Invoice - Android Apps on Google Play

AutoCAD 360 - Android Apps on Google Play

Yes, yes, I realize they're not the full blown actual Windows-based desktop class applications, but even so, you'd be amazed what's possible nowadays. :D

710.jpg
 

Spewn

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I can do this with my Lumia 950 and while it's actually practical I don't know how much of a replacement it would be for a laptop of desktop. For people that do basic tasks it's certainly possible. However convergence like this might play better for Microsoft since they are pretty well ahead in that game. I think scaling up to desktop capabilities is a bit harder than scaling down to phones and tablets.

Honestly, even for basic tasks Android sucks in a desktop environment. The OS doesn't really support a keyboard/mouse all that well, so even just normal browsing doesn't work as well as it does on a Windows machine. I say this as someone who used an Android TV box for about a year before upgrading to a Windows 10 Cherry Trail device. The difference is night and day, I went from being frustrated almost every time I had to use the device to having a great experience. I sold the Android box(for almost as much as I paid for it) and never looked back. Google would have to do some SERIOUS work for me to ever consider an Android device for the livingroom again, let alone the desktop where the issues would be even more of a problem.
 

heatlesssun

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Microsoft Office Mobile - Android Apps on Google Play

QuickBooks Accounting+Invoice - Android Apps on Google Play

AutoCAD 360 - Android Apps on Google Play

Yes, yes, I realize they're not the full blown actual Windows-based desktop class applications, but even so, you'd be amazed what's possible nowadays. :D

710.jpg


I guess the thing is that that we've sort of been down this road of phones and tablets replacing PCs, and that's really not worked as many had predicted. Yes, there are use cases where that can work, and mobile hardware and software has become more capable. But so has desktop hardware and software to some degree as well. And when you take a phone or tablet, give it a bigger screen and add a full sized keyboard and track pad, you're back to where you started with a laptop any, just not as capable as that that laptop. Again, that'll work for a lot of people but it also won't for a lot of people.

So the question is how much complexity and capability needs to be added to mobile platforms to make them "good enough" replacements for true desktop devices. We're not there yet, Windows for all of its issues has a big lead in the area of convergence and what can others bring to the table. The iPad Pro was certainly an attempt to gain traction in the 2 in 1 market and the results have been fairly mixed.

However it works out it'll be interesting. I convergence is a big force in the evolution of technology. When one device can effectively replace multiple devices, that usually marks a market shift. And smartphones have been revolutionary in this area, converging, dumb mobile phones, music players, GPS systems, digital cameras into one device. However all of these devices were mobile fixed function devices. Replacing more powerful, general purposed devices is significantly harder.
 

heatlesssun

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Honestly, even for basic tasks Android sucks in a desktop environment. The OS doesn't really support a keyboard/mouse all that well, so even just normal browsing doesn't work as well as it does on a Windows machine. I say this as someone who used an Android TV box for about a year before upgrading to a Windows 10 Cherry Trail device. The difference is night and day, I went from being frustrated almost every time I had to use the device to having a great experience. I sold the Android box(for almost as much as I paid for it) and never looked back. Google would have to do some SERIOUS work for me to ever consider an Android device for the livingroom again, let alone the desktop where the issues would be even more of a problem.

It think it's harder for Android to scale up for desktop capabilities that it is for Windows to scale down to mobile. Clearly Microsoft has failed in phones however they actually do have a pretty solid multi-device, multi-platform OS. The biggest problem was getting enough devices sold and getting those mobile apps. Android has the same problem with virtually all of clients being touch based phones and tablets. Adding solid desktop support and apps to support that is a lot of work for a market that's not really there.
 

Tawnos

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The drop in Mircosoft share is probably exclusively because they haven't released models for large portions of the market. They have a $140 model, a $200 model, and then a jump all the way up to the $500 model. They also only cover one carrier currently, AT&T. They have one model, almost two years old, for Verison, and no models that work with T-mobile or Sprint. Alcatel has a model for T-mobile, but it is not even known by most people. Couple that with a severe slowdown of app development for the platform, probably due to the lack of current models, and you get a collapsing brand.
0.o I have a Lumia 950 dual sim that works just fine with T-Mobile. Has all the LTE bands needed for the expanded T-Mobile spectrum as well.
 

kac77

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Honestly, even for basic tasks Android sucks in a desktop environment. The OS doesn't really support a keyboard/mouse all that well, so even just normal browsing doesn't work as well as it does on a Windows machine. I say this as someone who used an Android TV box for about a year before upgrading to a Windows 10 Cherry Trail device. The difference is night and day, I went from being frustrated almost every time I had to use the device to having a great experience. I sold the Android box(for almost as much as I paid for it) and never looked back. Google would have to do some SERIOUS work for me to ever consider an Android device for the livingroom again, let alone the desktop where the issues would be even more of a problem.

Considering you can install Kodi on that thing I find it hard to believe that Windows without something like Kodi would be better than Android TV with it. This is from someone who uses Windows in the living room and without something like Kodi it would be hard to use and that's putting it lightly.
 

heatlesssun

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Considering you can install Kodi on that thing I find it hard to believe that Windows without something like Kodi would be better than Android TV with it. This is from someone who uses Windows in the living room and without something like Kodi it would be hard to use and that's putting it lightly.

Not sure what you mean, there's Kodi for Windows.
 

Spewn

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Considering you can install Kodi on that thing I find it hard to believe that Windows without something like Kodi would be better than Android TV with it. This is from someone who uses Windows in the living room and without something like Kodi it would be hard to use and that's putting it lightly.

It's fundamental to the fact that Android is a touch operating system. It can "emulate" a mouse and keyboard input but it's not very good at it, and if you spend any real time using it compared to a Windows machine it's a chore. The way you interact with webpages and programs in general is just not as smooth and, generally, not as intuitive. You can find it hard to believe all you want, but I've used both and I'm telling you without question Windows is much better in essentially every way.
 

aarcam

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Im on windows phone with M10 and quite frankly love it. I dont know what I would transition to. I would get apps out the ass, but would miss the core OS.

Now, the fact that the Microsoft version of Apps hits my wifes iPhone first or with better quality app is a bit of a slight, but hey even MS follows the users (money).

I dont think it will die for quite some time. If things change in the market MS will still be relevant and can release the occasional halo device, aka Surface Phone (crosses fingers).
 

chockomonkey

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I recently switched from Win 8.1 to Android 6.x as my Lumia 822 was getting old and slow. I miss my old phone. It's nice having access to some of the Android apps that I couldn't run before, but I'd be happier if things worked as well as my Windows phone. Outlook for Android doesn't support Exchange tasks, Skype for Business and Outlook notifications show up late (if at all), texts aren't read when connected to BT, etc. Nothing huge, but annoying.
I recently switched from a Lumia 820 to a Note4, and I do miss some things from WP... mostly the keyboard. I don't know how Android can have so many users and yet have a shittier keyboard.

Ideally I'd have a mix of these two platforms. The Keyboard and Glance from WP, and Voice and app store from Android.
 

rezerekted

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An Android desktop OS would be worse than Win10 even so no. I have an android tablet and it is all up in your business so know what to expect.
 

ChadD

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MS may have a passable mobile platform these days... I can't say I know. I haven't heard anything terrible about there most recent offerings. The simple issue is they have burned users for to long in that market. To many changes, to many new OS that didn't play well with the previous OS, to much bunk hardware (pre nokia days). MS had a HUGE head start on Android, Windows phones (the old ones) where around before Android before Iphone and MS never really took the market seriously. It killed them in the eyes of many early adopters. Which means when people ask me, should I get one of these new MS phones... all I can remember are those terrible Windows phones I over paid for back in the day.

MS tried to hard to push their desktop onto the mobile platform. I mean the idea is good and its where everyone is heading... its only a matter of time before Apple and Google only offer one true Multi platform OS. MS should have put together a proper Mobile OS way back when iphone 1 launched. They where using a butchered up Win CE and it was passable... when Apple raised the bar, they should have spent ALL the money they wasted buying Nokia years later and developed a proper Mobile OS to compete. Had they done that they would have yes been playing catch up with Apple, but they may have headed off the growth of Android. Had they been smart enough to give it away and not charge licencing to the likes of Samsung and LG... ya never mind the more I type the more I realise that just isn't MS. At this point they will require pretty much perfect execution over the next 5 years just to exist in the OS space in 10. My guess is they aren't capable of that... and in 10 years we will use the word Microsoft the same way we say things like Yahoo, Netscape, Myspace and Corel.

EDIT... just read another piece of news about which companies are contributing code to the Linux kernal... and I think its telling that #1 is Intel and AMD isn't far behind yet still behind Samsung(over 4,000 changes added by Samsung) in terms of changes made to the kernal. When the time hits in the next year or two when Apple start shipping ARM based laptops and desktops, the old Windows machine sellers are going to be looking for a solution. If google steps up with a linux kernal powered android desktop, The x86 guys wanna ensure they don't get cut out. :)
 
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nutzo

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Sad thing is the platform is really good it just has that "no app" stigma

And that is the problem. To bad they dropped the plan to add the ability to run android apps, as that would have largely solved that problem.
 

kac77

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It's fundamental to the fact that Android is a touch operating system. It can "emulate" a mouse and keyboard input but it's not very good at it, and if you spend any real time using it compared to a Windows machine it's a chore. The way you interact with webpages and programs in general is just not as smooth and, generally, not as intuitive. You can find it hard to believe all you want, but I've used both and I'm telling you without question Windows is much better in essentially every way.
Touch doesn't have anything to do with living room use. Sorry used them both. There's remotes to both. Both suck without them.
 

kac77

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Not sure what you mean, there's Kodi for Windows.
I know. What I'm saying is that yes, Android makes a pretty bad desktop. However, for a living room HTPC it's not bad at all. Both require remotes to use properly and there are a plethora of solutions for both.
 

Spewn

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Touch doesn't have anything to do with living room use. Sorry used them both. There's remotes to both. Both suck without them.

How the hell do you use a browser with a remote? That doesn't even make sense. Touch has a LOT to do with livingroom use if you stop thinking of the box as a set-top box(which it's not) and start thinking of it as a livingroom PC(which it is). Maybe I do more with my device than you do, and that's fine, but it doesn't change the fact that Android is laughably bad compared to Windows for actual use as a PC.
 

heatlesssun

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How the hell do you use a browser with a remote? That doesn't even make sense. Touch has a LOT to do with livingroom use if you stop thinking of the box as a set-top box(which it's not) and start thinking of it as a livingroom PC(which it is). Maybe I do more with my device than you do, and that's fine, but it doesn't change the fact that Android is laughably bad compared to Windows for actual use as a PC.

When it comes to an HPTC the best remote is a mini integrated Bluetooth keyboard and trackpad.
 

Spewn

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When it comes to an HPTC the best remote is a mini integrated Bluetooth keyboard and trackpad.

Sure but...that's a "keyboard and mouse", not a remote, in terms of functionality, and it will work MUCH better with a Windows machine than an Android one just due to the way each OS interprets that sort of input.
 

heatlesssun

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Sure but...that's a "keyboard and mouse", not a remote, in terms of functionality, and it will work MUCH better with a Windows machine than an Android one just due to the way each OS interprets that sort of input.

Agreed, Android is a touch first OS, keyboards, mice and other input methods are generally afterthoughts.
 

Spewn

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Agreed, Android is a touch first OS, keyboards, mice and other input methods are generally afterthoughts.

And it's not just the OS, something that could be updated to include better compatibility with keyboard/mouse input, it's the apps. Everything built for Android is built for touch, and that becomes very apparent if you try to use a keyboard/mouse-style input with an Android device. It's not a good experience.
 
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