Microsoft to Remove Ability to Install Win 11 Pro Without Being Online and Signing in to Microsoft Account

Zarathustra[H]

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Updates to existing installations to require creation and/or login to Microsoft account once installed.

https://www.pcgamesn.com/windows-11/internet-connection-install

I guess they've finally done it. If you thought "always online" requirements for single player games was bad, here comes the era of always online requirements for all computing.

I guess this means I'm staying on Windows 10, and once it goes EOL I guess I'll just have to stop using Windows all together.

Luckily gaming on Linux keeps getting better! Hopefully by the time Windows 10 goes EOL in 2025, there will no longer be a Linux gaming performance penalty.

I guess there you have it. 2025 is finally the "Year of Desktop Linux" :p
 
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Segfault

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I have been happy chap ever since I ditched MS operating system. 2003 it was, will be 20 years anniversary soon. I admit, once I wanted to try W10 out of curiosity and tried to install it in a virtual machine. First I got "a genuine free copy of W10" from some dark corner of internet. It installed, but started bombing me with chinese ads. I realized Windows must be a Chinese product now, like everything else and used "rm" command to erase the VM image. I have a little Mac just in case there is something proprietary which cannot be run on Linux or BSD. I need it rarely nowadays.
 

Zarathustra[H]

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I have been happy chap ever since I ditched MS operating system. 2003 it was, will be 20 years anniversary soon. I admit, once I wanted to try W10 out of curiosity and tried to install it in a virtual machine. First I got "a genuine free copy of W10" from some dark corner of internet. It installed, but started bombing me with chinese ads. I realized Windows must be a Chinese product now, like everything else and used "rm" command to erase the VM image. I have a little Mac just in case there is something proprietary which cannot be run on Linux or BSD. I need it rarely nowadays.

I've been using Linux/BSD for everything at home now too for over 20 years...

...except games. I do still play the occasional game, and since I also play at 4k, I can't afford even a single digit percentage performance loss. Linux gaming has been getting better though. Hopefully in 3 years time when Win10 goes EOL it will be good enough for me.

That and work is also Microsoft based, but at least enterprise installations can use LTSB installs.
 

Lakados

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A bit overblown.

Similar to Windows 11 Home edition, Windows 11 Pro edition now requires internet connectivity during the initial device setup (OOBE) only.

So the Shift-F10 exit should work fine, you can then setup windows as per normal but you will have to set your privacy and security permissions manually once booted.
 

Zarathustra[H]

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A bit overblown.

Similar to Windows 11 Home edition, Windows 11 Pro edition now requires internet connectivity during the initial device setup (OOBE) only.

So the Shift-F10 exit should work fine, you can then setup windows as per normal but you will have to set your privacy and security permissions manually once booted.

It is going to require a Microsoft account. Local accounts are going away.

Both the primary user, and all secondary users will have to sign in with a Microsoft account, or no dice.

The source article is pretty clear about that:

https://www.windowscentral.com/wind...e-internet-connection-when-setting-first-time
 

Lakados

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It is going to require a Microsoft account. Local accounts are going away.

Both the primary user, and all secondary users will have to sign in with a Microsoft account, or no dice.

The source article is pretty clear about that:

https://www.windowscentral.com/wind...e-internet-connection-when-setting-first-time
If you choose to setup device for personal use, MSA (Microsoft Account) will be required for setup as well.

But not if you choose Business account, that will still take you to a local user account creation. As it is for windows Pro it will still have the requirement to create a local account first.
 

Segfault

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Windows is a monument for sales skills of Bill Gates. Selling an OS which is not secure enough to be connected to the internet ... Cars allowed on the public roads must pass DOT tests, if there was similar requirement for operating systems then Windows would be out of business. Billions, tens of billions of dollars are the damages every year, because Windows is a free platform for everybody who wants to break the law. Even a kid can buy a Windows break-in kit and use it successfully. To add insult to injury - these kits come with warranty, if MS happens to patch the vulnerability they are exploiting then you get a new kit for free ...
 

Zarathustra[H]

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If you choose to setup device for personal use, MSA (Microsoft Account) will be required for setup as well.

But not if you choose Business account, that will still take you to a local user account creation. As it is for windows Pro it will still have the requirement to create a local account first.

I have not yet played with Windows 11, but in Windows 10 all of these "business features" were tied to having Enterprise/LTSB licenses, which us mere mortals cannot obtain, so the ability to use local accounts with a business account is moot.
 

Tengis

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I have been happy chap ever since I ditched MS operating system. 2003 it was, will be 20 years anniversary soon. I admit, once I wanted to try W10 out of curiosity and tried to install it in a virtual machine. First I got "a genuine free copy of W10" from some dark corner of internet. It installed, but started bombing me with chinese ads. I realized Windows must be a Chinese product now, like everything else and used "rm" command to erase the VM image. I have a little Mac just in case there is something proprietary which cannot be run on Linux or BSD. I need it rarely nowadays.
Wut.

I dont even know how to respond to this because it reads like a joke but looks like a legitimate story.
 

Lakados

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I have not yet played with Windows 11, but in Windows 10 all of these "business features" were tied to having Enterprise/LTSB licenses, which us mere mortals cannot obtain, so the ability to use local accounts with a business account is moot.
They were there in Pro, otherwise all the OEM’s would be screwed in Pro you can hit Shift-F10 then back, proceed with the install with non OOBE choose “Setup for work or Business” create your local account, choose to set it up with no password to avoid the stupid picking of three password reset questions. Then just Ctrl-Alt-Del and change password to add one to the account.

Then in my case I would add it to the domain, then after rebooting tell it to manually pull down it’s group policies which then contacts the KMS server updates it to Enterprise and reboots.

But being able to choose to do the setup for a business account and then creating a local account and bypassing the whole need to have a Microsoft account which is the initial complaint is it not?
 

Zarathustra[H]

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But being able to choose to do the setup for a business account and then creating a local account and bypassing the whole need to have a Microsoft account which is the initial complaint is it not?

Having my independent computer somehow tied to a cloud account is a complete non-negotiable for me.

I do not have a Microsoft account now, and I will never have a Microsoft account.

Similarly, I would never use an apple device for the same reason, as it requires you to create an Apple account.

If the computer is not managed 100% locally, I want no part of it.
 

GotNoRice

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It is going to require a Microsoft account. Local accounts are going away.

Both the primary user, and all secondary users will have to sign in with a Microsoft account, or no dice.

The source article is pretty clear about that:

https://www.windowscentral.com/wind...e-internet-connection-when-setting-first-time

What the hell are you talking about? The article you linked says nothing even remotely like what you claimed.

The quote from Microsoft says:
Similar to Windows 11 Home edition, Windows 11 Pro edition now requires internet connectivity during the initial device setup (OOBE) only. If you choose to setup device for personal use, MSA will be required for setup as well. You can expect Microsoft Account to be required in subsequent WIP flights.

The key here is the phrase "setup device for personal use". That is because during setup, you have two choices. You can "Set up for Work or School", and then Domain Join. All that (Domain Join) actually does at this point in setup, is create a local account, and you continue on into windows using that Local Account.

Observe how it plays out in practice during setup (this is from the same dev build mentioned in the article, the latest build)

Windows11account1.png


Windows11account2.png


Windows11account3.png


Windows11account4.png


In no way, shape, or form are you required to convert that to a Microsoft Account down the line either. It might pester you to, but you are not forced, and the notifications can be disabled easily.
 

Zarathustra[H]

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What the hell are you talking about? The article you linked says nothing even remotely like what you claimed.

The quote from Microsoft says:


The key here is the phrase "setup device for personal use". That is because during setup, you have two choices. You can "Set up for Work or School", and then Domain Join. All that (Domain Join) actually does at this point in setup, is create a local account, and you continue on into windows using that Local Account.

Observe how it plays out in practice during setup (this is from the same dev build mentioned in the article, the latest build)

View attachment 446767

View attachment 446768

View attachment 446769

View attachment 446770

In no way, shape, or form are you required to convert that to a Microsoft Account down the line either. It might pester you to, but you are not forced, and the notifications can be disabled easily.

That may be how it works today, but the article clearly suggests that is not how it is going to work in the future.

Hopefully you are right though.
 

Lakados

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That may be how it works today, but the article clearly suggests that is not how it is going to work in the future.

Hopefully you are right though.
If Microsoft removes the ability to create a local account on a Pro install it will completely fuck over all the OEM’s and all Enterprise clients. But the article does have all the key words in there that exclude the “Work or School” portion of the Pro setup.

This whole thing may be a precursor to the expected EU ruling that would require Microsoft, Apple, and Google to remember privacy settings across devices. So if you turn it off in one place it’s off on all of them, they’ve been getting uppity about people having to repeat the same process time and time again. Especially on devices that don’t have visual devices interfaces, like Alexa and such. Because eventually a user forgets to turn off a privacy setting on one of their devices making the fact they have it turned off on all the others pointless because of how all the other sync features work.
 

Eulogy

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That may be how it works today, but the article clearly suggests that is not how it is going to work in the future.

Hopefully you are right though.
It's only in the fast ring right now and only for feedback. The constant fear mongering, especially with incomplete and inaccurate information, gets old. I miss the days when the news section here had... well, standards.
 

Lakados

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It's only in the fast ring right now and only for feedback. The constant fear mongering, especially with incomplete and inaccurate information, gets old. I miss the days when the news section here had... well, standards.
This is more on PCGames than Zarathustra[H], if you don’t know about the different windows domain setup options or Pro configurations then it sounds scarier than it is.
 

GiGaBiTe

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I have been happy chap ever since I ditched MS operating system. 2003 it was, will be 20 years anniversary soon. I admit, once I wanted to try W10 out of curiosity and tried to install it in a virtual machine. First I got "a genuine free copy of W10" from some dark corner of internet. It installed, but started bombing me with chinese ads. I realized Windows must be a Chinese product now, like everything else and used "rm" command to erase the VM image. I have a little Mac just in case there is something proprietary which cannot be run on Linux or BSD. I need it rarely nowadays.

I've been using Linux since 2002 myself, and within the last year ditched almost all vestiges of Windows from my house.

The last holdout was my Windows 7 gaming rig, but when it came time to upgrade it, I went to Fedora and never looked back. There were a few teething issues, but nothing on the scale of the Windows 10 dumpster fire. Now I don't have to worry about forced updates bricking my system while I'm away, as well as unwanted ads and malware automatically pumped to my system from the MS hivemind. I just barely escaped the forced Windows 10 upgrade MS was doing for over a year by sneakily hiding it within other updates, as well as re-issuing the same KB2952664 and KB3031917 and several dozen other updates to get around people blocking them.

The only Windows 10 box I have left is a dilapidated Precision T7500 in the garage used for when I'm working at my bench. The only reason it stays Windows 10 is because I'm too lazy to migrate all of the files off and install Linux. I'll probably do it the next time Windows 10 decides to nuke itself during an update, which won't be that long. MS introduces a system cratering update it seems like every few months.
 

Zarathustra[H]

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This is more on PCGames than Zarathustra[H], if you don’t know about the different windows domain setup options or Pro configurations then it sounds scarier than it is.

Well, I ahvent played with Windows 11 yet. Last install I did was a Windows 10 Pro install, and I don't recall having an option to choose "work or school" or anything like that. It just popped up and prompted you to log in using your microsoft account.

Had to unplug the ethernet cable and reboot and restart the install to have the local account option show up.

I'm generally of the opinion that there is no benefit to being "first" when it comes to software. While new hardware is awesome, when it comes to software it is always better to delay going with the new as long as possible. Let someone else figure out all the bugs.

I usually keep a current software version until it goes EOL (which I define as "stops receiving security patches") after which I "upgrade" to the next oldest version.

In 2021 I upgraded all of my 16.04 LTS Ubuntu server installs to 18.04 LTS, a 3 year old release. Sure, 20.04 LTS was out, as were several non-LTS releases, but generally I always want to be on the oldest supported LTS release available.

This is my philosophy as regards compatibility and stability and why I likely will not touch Windows 11 until Windows 10 goes EOL in 2025 (at which point it would be nice if I can still install it without using a Microsoft account, and if not, I guess I'll just stick to Linux and delete my Windows partitions.
 
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1_rick

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Well, I ahvent played with Windows 11 yet. Last install I did was a Windows 10 Pro install, and I don't recall having an option to choose "work or school" or anything like that. It just popped up and prompted you to log in using your microsoft account.

Had to unplug the etherner cable and reboot and restart the install to have the local account option show up.
Yeah, that's how you did it. Or make sure you had an ISO from before they started playing that game. I think the 2009 installer was clean of it, and as long as you were online you just had to tell it to get bent and that you wanted a local account. You can still, as far as I know, do that if you have an older install image.

The same will probably work with 11 going forward. I bought a copy of 11 Pro when I built my Alder Lake system last December, and if I need to install it on any other machines, I'll just use the USB drive it came with, the appropriate key, and then let it update itself. Obviously, this won't work for people who didn't get in early.

why I likely will not touch Windows 11 until Windows 10 goes EOL in 2025 (at which point it would be nice if I can still install it without using a Microsoft account

Buy an uncontaminated copy of 11 now. :)
 

GiGaBiTe

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Well, I ahvent played with Windows 11 yet. Last install I did was a Windows 10 Pro install, and I don't recall having an option to choose "work or school" or anything like that. It just popped up and prompted you to log in using your microsoft account.

Microsoft makes the "local account" button invisible and the text color almost the same as the background purple color in the bottom left side of the screen during the account setup process. It's easy to miss it.

Also depending on what install version you're using, it can actually not exist at all. MS has gone back and forth with enabling and disabling the local account button several times. The best option if you have to setup a new Windows 10 install is to just leave the Ethernet unplugged and the wifi turned off. If Windows even gets a slight whiff of an internet connection, it'll do it's damnedest to get you to make a Microsoft account.
 

ThreeDee

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I don't know .. I just setup a new desktop with Windows 11 to sell. I just keep the network cable unplugged during install so it defaults to creating a local account. I think I've gotten a couple nags on it to create an account is all after plugging into network and getting things fully updated.
 

Aurelius

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Similarly, I would never use an apple device for the same reason, as it requires you to create an Apple account.
No it doesn't! Now, Apple certainly encourages creating an Apple ID, but it's really there for iCloud services and App Store software.
 

Armenius

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Having my independent computer somehow tied to a cloud account is a complete non-negotiable for me.

I do not have a Microsoft account now, and I will never have a Microsoft account.

Similarly, I would never use an apple device for the same reason, as it requires you to create an Apple account.

If the computer is not managed 100% locally, I want no part of it.
Cloud is optional. All cloud services on my install of Windows 10 are disabled.
 

sfsuphysics

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Updates to existing installations to require creation and/or login to Microsoft account once installed.

https://www.pcgamesn.com/windows-11/internet-connection-install

I guess they've finally done it. If you thought "always online" requirements for single player games was bad, here comes the era of always online requirements for all computing.
Maybe it was buried deeper in the story but this is only a requirement to be online to install? Not that you need to stay online just to use?
 

cpufrost

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Boy they just keep fuxoring this up more and more as time goes on!
Not having a local account is absolutely silly.
What's next, banning dicks on wooden hobby horses? :-P
 

Ranulfo

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Windows 10 dumpster fire? Half the crap I read on here is like somebody joined a tribe and is slinging fecal matter, raging money style. Like an old man screaming to get off his lawn.

Can I interest you in a membership to the Windows White Knight club? Only $8.99/month!
 

Zarathustra[H]

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Cloud is optional. All cloud services on my install of Windows 10 are disabled.

Anything that is not on my local machine is cloud.

If I need a Microsoft account to log in to my local machine, that is cloud.

If my computer depends on anything outside of my computer, like a login account tied to the Microsoft cloud, is it really even my computer anymore?
 

OFaceSIG

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I too like many hate this idea. I really hope they never mess with Pro version as other's have stated. That's my currently my only out when eventually I go to 11.
 

techie81

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Can I interest you in a membership to the Windows White Knight club? Only $8.99/month!
How dare you insult Microsoft! They are just fighting for social justice with poor programmers trying to make it in this harsh world!

Seriously though, people are way too sensitive about the smallest feedback to Microsoft's horrible design plans. Even if they haven't implemented the removal of the local account now, they are working hard to make that happen. Pepperidge farms remembers when Microsoft actually innovated and produced an exciting product. Now the focus is how can we screw the end user, add a bunch of useless crap that no one will use and cram more telemetry into windows.
 

Darunion

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Pepperidge farms remembers when Microsoft actually innovated and produced an exciting product.

Like Microsoft BOB? Paint maybe but not an original idea either. Or maybe their phones, that was pretty innovative with the live tiles.
 

MrGuvernment

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I had the exact same reaction. Thinking about switching everything to Linux gives me anxiety. Windows 10 works fine.
What do you use your computer for?

Gaming, stay windows...
Windows only Apps - stay windows...

Dont mind using Openoffice and dont play games, go get linux, it is not hard at all.
 

NickM

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Wut.

I dont even know how to respond to this because it reads like a joke but looks like a legitimate story.
Yeah-my eyes rolled so hard reading that, I now know what the inside of my skull looks like.
 

Shoganai

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Windows 11 Home online can be circumvented already. So if they “remove” this like they did in Home, you can still set up an offline account. Basically, if you connect to WiFi and then unplug your modem, the set up process thinks your internet sucks and then it will give you the option of setting up the computer with an offline account. I discovered this by accident when my internet went down during an 11 Home setup and then verified this on purpose several times after to verify it. Works every time.
 

Eulogy

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Seriously though, people are way too sensitive about the smallest feedback to Microsoft's horrible design plans.
The only folks I see as sensitive, are the likes of this post, and others who fear monger and post misinformation and incomplete information. Then some of us came in and posted actual facts, with supporting evidence, and that's "white knighting" and "way too sensitive". lol.
 

DukenukemX

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What do you use your computer for?

Gaming, stay windows...
Windows only Apps - stay windows...

Dont mind using Openoffice and dont play games, go get linux, it is not hard at all.
As someone who uses Linux on like 90%+ devices, there are some issues. Gaming is probably the hardest part since many games don't work out of the box and if they do then it won't work online because of anti-cheat. Then there are other applications which I still have an issue getting to work perfectly like Photoshop CS6 and now Fusion 360. They work but they barely work.
 

GotNoRice

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