LG 48CX

[MistaSparkul]

And this is exactly why some of us will not use an OLED tv as a monitor. I want to turn on the monitor and forget it. Don't want to baby sit it and do annoying little task to prevent burn in.

I haven't done a single ounce of babysitting on my CX and I even disabled ASBL (not to be confused with ABL which cannot be disabled). I use it for however long I want throughout the day sometimes up to 14 hours straight then just turn the TV off when I go to bed. Still no burn in so far, I think it just comes down to not blasting it at 80 OLED light.

 

[SoCali]

And this is exactly why some of us will not use an OLED tv as a monitor. I want to turn on the monitor and forget it. Don't want to baby sit it and do annoying little task to prevent burn in.

I really don't consider turning off a TV (or letting it turn itself off when not in use based on Windows Power settings) 1 time every 8 hours as babysitting.

 

[lors]

And this is exactly why some of us will not use an OLED tv as a monitor. I want to turn on the monitor and forget it. Don't want to baby sit it and do annoying little task to prevent burn in.

Yes, it takes insane predictive time management skills, such as turning off the lights from time to time when you leave a room.

 

[defaultluser]

Yes, it takes insane predictive time management skills, such as turning off the lights from time to time when you leave a room.

Or leaving on the auto power-off feature on the set.

Been enjoying this new feature pushed at the start of the year on my B7 (handled this all manually before with automated black screensaver, plus power-off overnight), but now with reliable power-off, no-longer freak out i f the dog runs over the remote while I'm at work

Still no burn-in after 3+ years mixed-use. I've also be amazed how long this 4.5 year old TV has been receiving Firmware updates (just got one last week!)

 

[kalston]

Ah yeah let's abuse the panel and make a fear-mongering video about it.

To be fair I'm not sure what happens when the average joe buys such a display to use it as a monitor... Personally I did a lot of research beforehand and made certain it suited my use cases (and my room). Only seems natural to me with the price tag on those sets. But that's me.

My panel is also totally flawless after more than a year of 10h a day or so and it's been such joy to use it and I do hope it lasts as long as possible (since I'm in a dark room I am confident it will be years) but frankly for me the OLED perks are such a big deal that I won't hesitate to replace it with another similar one if I have to. I truly can't do LCD for gaming or films anymore.

 

[equinox654]

I have had mine for a year and if I am working I keep the oled light at 10-30. It usually the lower bit of the range.. If I fire up a game I crank the brightness to 80-100. If it supports HDR 100.
No signs of burn in yet. Around 2k hours on the panel.

I imagine most of of here know how to take care of it or at least what not to do and in all the time this thread has been going on I haven't seen any scary burn in stories.
Linus said he employee had been borrowing it while waiting to get one. I wonder if he ran it full blast for a few months.

 

[madpistol]

LTT video about IR he experienced has people terrified of owning a OLED:

Running in SDR at OLED brightness of 60-80 10 hours per day as a desktop monitor will DEFINITELY cause this screen to degrade prematurely. No doubt about it. However, the majority of users on this forum take care of their screens and run OLED brightness around 0-30 in SDR. That is the mostly agreed upon "safe zone" for these displays.

Seriously, Linus and Wendel were absolutely abusing their screens.

For reference, I have 7440 hours on my CX. Zero burn-in.

 

[equinox654]

Running in SDR at OLED brightness of 60-80 10 hours per day as a desktop monitor will DEFINITELY cause this screen to degrade prematurely. No doubt about it. However, the majority of users on this forum take care of their screens and run OLED brightness around 0-30 in SDR. That is the mostly agreed upon "safe zone" for these displays.

Seriously, Linus and Wendel were absolutely abusing their screens.

For reference, I have 7440 hours on my CX. Zero burn-in.

Lol 7440 huh. That would last me another 3 years. So the thing could last 4-5 years which would be longer than I have ever run a display on my pc. Think the record goes to an asus 34" 3440x1440 100hz ultrawide at 3.5 years.

 

[MistaSparkul]

Running in SDR at OLED brightness of 60-80 10 hours per day as a desktop monitor will DEFINITELY cause this screen to degrade prematurely. No doubt about it. However, the majority of users on this forum take care of their screens and run OLED brightness around 0-30 in SDR. That is the mostly agreed upon "safe zone" for these displays.

Seriously, Linus and Wendel were absolutely abusing their screens.

For reference, I have 7440 hours on my CX. Zero burn-in.

Running that high of a brightness level would mean that their room already has tons of ambient lighting to begin with, in which case they are hugely mitigating one of OLED's key advantages over an LCD display which is the contrast. Blacks are going to look inky even on a TN panel if the room is bright enough. They really picked the wrong display type for their specific use case scenario, which doesn't surprise me one bit as I never considered Linus nor Wendell to be display experts.

 

[Surly]

Running in SDR at OLED brightness of 60-80 10 hours per day as a desktop monitor will DEFINITELY cause this screen to degrade prematurely. No doubt about it. However, the majority of users on this forum take care of their screens and run OLED brightness around 0-30 in SDR. That is the mostly agreed upon "safe zone" for these displays.

Seriously, Linus and Wendel were absolutely abusing their screens.

For reference, I have 7440 hours on my CX. Zero burn-in.

Mostly as media consumption device or 8-5 monitor replacement workhorse?

 

[madpistol]

Mostly as media consumption device or 8-5 monitor replacement workhorse?

Switching between both, actually.

 

[SoCali]

I just checked out a friends 48" C1 he just got and it has a noticeable pink tint to whites. I brought over my service remote and saw he has the WBE "Evo" panel from the G1 which explains it. Other than the default game modes calibration being light years better than my CX which is way too green heavy, I can't really tell it apart.

 

[elvn]

I use side VA 4k screens for desktop/apps and keep the 48CX as a media and gaming "stage".

When I'm not actively viewing media or playing a game on it, and whenever I pause or walk away from my pc, I use the "turn off the screen" trick (2 clicks on the quick menu or using the micrphone button to say it with the voice commands active)
-- to turn the emitters off without dropping the now "dead looking" but otherwise functioning normally screen out of the equation. It's more or less like minimizing the whole screen before I walk away or when I'm not actively using it. Touching any button on the remote turns the emitters back on instantly.

I also use "translucent taskbar" and "taskbar hider" with a taskbar show/hide toggle hotkey set up in that app. I can drag the taskbar to one of my secondary monitors too.

I didn't turn off any brightness limiters or anything either. I'm not saying you have to do any of this with yours but it's what I do with mine.

I do run HDR movies and HDR games on the display. I also mod SDR games to higher volume using Reshade with a fakeHDR filter and a lightroom filter. Similarly, I'll eventually be using windows 11's auotmatic SDR enhancement (~ SDR+ color volume kind of thing).

I also have the best buy 5 yr warranty which covers burn in. It came out to around $60 a year for the 5 years of insurance.

 

[TwistedMetalGear]

I wonder what percentage of us are going to switch to the 42" when it's available. I actually quite like the 48" size after getting used to it. Doesn't even seem that big anymore. But I wouldn't be against the higher DPI of the 42".

 

[sharknice]

I don't imagine many people would switch. Probably a lot of new people buying them that didn't have room for the 48 though.

After actually using 48" for a while it seems like the perfect size to me. The size and DPI pairs perfectly with the 24" 1080p screens I have stacked on the sides. It's just like having 4 of them with no bezels. So it's awesome for productivity and while gaming it's the perfect size for immersion.

 

[kasakka]

I wonder what percentage of us are going to switch to the 42" when it's available. I actually quite like the 48" size after getting used to it. Doesn't even seem that big anymore. But I wouldn't be against the higher DPI of the 42".

I would wait to see how it actually performs but otherwise I might. I have gotten used to the 48" but it's still a large screen and the 42" might be a better sweet spot and would also be easier to pair with a side monitor. In my current setup I have to put my Genelec speakers on the very edge of my desk to get them next to the screen rather than in front of it.

 

[SoCali]

I am going to switch to the 42" for sure as long as it's at parity with the CX/C1 48" and up models spec/feature wise. I still think 48" is too big both in physical size and pixel density. Playing city builders or ARPG's with UI elements you have to constantly reference at the corners is tiresome. The pixel density increase is also welcome.

 

[elvn]

Pixel density as is perceived by your eyes is relative to viewing distance. Even with a 42" OLED you'd have to sit pretty far away to be at a proper viewing distance.

You have to sit to where the 20/20 vision threshold starts at 60PPD or beyond on any screen or you will have more jumbo pixels and subpixels. People try to use different kinds of cleartype alternatives and more aggressive AA in games (with a performance hit) but it won't ever be as good as sitting at an appropriate distance. I suspect a lot of people aren't sitting far enough away which exacerbates text fringing and graphics/pixel aliasing as well as pushing the HUD elements far into the periphery.

For the 48" 4k CX, the 60PPD ~ 20/20 vision threshold starts at 33.5" .. and starts at 1.5' away for 27" 4k. At those two distances the screens will look the same (60 PPD).
If you sit ~48" away from a 48" 4k screen you get into the 20/15 range though and require very little AA. You can even get away w/o AA for the most part if you wanted to.

==========================================

48" 4k at 33" or less viewing distance:
59.3 ppd is below 20/20 vision; most everyone can see individual pixels. You likely need strong anti-aliasing to hide artifacts.
= jumbo pixels to your eyes, bad text fringing
-------------------------------
48" 4k at 33.5" viewing distance:
60 ppd is above the 20/20 vision threshold of 60 ppd, but below the average vision of ~20/15. You likely need moderate anti-aliasing.
= moderate aliasing that can be more or less compensated for with AA (usually at the cost of some frame rate loss) and sub-sampling on text
-----------------------------------
48" 4k at 47"+ viewing distance:
Anti-aliasing is only necessary in medium- and high-contrast areas.
----------------------------------

I typically sit 38" to 48" away. If I find I'm not looking at my HUD enough to my detriment in some games I'll kick back to near 48"
When you sit around the same distance away as the monitor's diagonal measurement you are making a more or less equilateral triangle out of your viewing angle and the screen width. Any closer it's a squashed fat triangle (or pyramid) with a more extreme angle to view the corners which can affect how easily you can view your HUD elements.

==========================================

Viewing distances in regard to a 43" 4k come out to:

-- Less than 30" viewing distance = below 20/20 vision; most everyone can see individual pixels. You likely need strong anti-aliasing to hide artifacts.
= jumbo pixels to your eyes, bad text fringing

-- 30" + viewing distance = 60 ppd is above the 20/20 vision threshold of 60 ppd, but below the average vision of ~20/15. You likely need moderate anti-aliasing
= moderate aliasing that can be more or less compensated for with AA (usually at the cost of some frame rate loss) and sub-sampling on text

-- 42"+ viewing distance = 80 ppd is moderate, slightly above the average visual acuity; few can see individual pixels. Anti-aliasing is only necessary in medium- and high-contrast areas.

==================================

For a 42" 4k the viewing distances are:

--- ~ 29" or less viewing distance = lower than 60 PPD, below 20/20 vision; most everyone can see individual pixels. You likely need strong anti-aliasing to hide artifacts.
= jumbo pixels to your eyes, aliased graphics, bad text fringing

--- Over 29" viewing distance = above the 20/20 vision threshold of 60 ppd, but below the average vision of ~20/15. You likely need moderate anti-aliasing.


--- ~ 41" viewing distance = 80 PPD which is is moderate, slightly above the average visual acuity; few can see individual pixels. Anti-aliasing only necessary in medium- and high-contrast areas.

==================================

27" 4k :

18" and less = less than 60PPD, below 20/20 vision threshold, bad graphics aliasing and text fringing

19"+ = 60PPD+ , above the 20/20 vision threshold, need moderate AA, text subsampling

26.5"+ = 80PPD+ ,above the 20/15 visual acuity threshold, few can see individual pixels, AA only necessary in medium and high contrast areas.

 

[elvn]

My living room vizio M low density FALD VA tv from late 2015 is on the way out, dying, so I am going to replace it by xmas.

As much as I would love a huge OLED in the living room, I don't think the usage scenario is there for it. It can be a brightly lit room at times with a large/picture window, but mostly I can't rely on or put the expectation on other people to not fall asleep with static material on the screen or leave youtube paused forgetting about it, to be religious about using the "turn of the screen" trick when they are afk every single time, and other safe use practices I use on my 48 CX - so I'd always be concerned in the back of my mind.. At my pc, it's just me in control of the usage practices and I also generally don't fall asleep at my pc.

Considering that, I'm probably going to buy the best reasonable FALD VA that compares to OLED which is currently the QN90A Neo "QLED" (75" version). It only has one hdmi 2.1 120hz VRR port but that's enough for one console or one pc so should be good enough if I ever get a PS5 or if I ever decide to run a pc hdmi 2.1 gpu's cable to the big tv someday. I don't think the tv does 24hz content x5 on the 120hz port for movies by default (not certain) .. but if it did I could just use a hdmi 2.1 console for streaming apps or whenever a hdmi 2.1 nvidia shield gets released. You could use the smart tv versions if they worked well enough but notably the ethernet port on the samsung is 10/100 and not gigabit though.. just like the LG OLED's ethernet..

https://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/samsung/qn90a-qled

 

[ND40oz]

I'd be keeping an eye on pricing for the 48C1 to replace my 55B6 in my office and shopmyexchange seemed to have the best deal at 1199 but then they put the 55C1 on sale for 1199 this week and couldn't pass it up. Oh well, I guess I'll just wait for 8k for a true monitor replacement at this point.

 

[Lateralus]

My living room vizio M low density FALD VA tv from late 2015 is on the way out, dying, so I am going to replace it by xmas.

As much as I would love a huge OLED in the living room, I don't think the usage scenario is there for it. It can be a brightly lit room at times with a large/picture window, but mostly I can't rely on or put the expectation on other people to not fall asleep with static material on the screen or leave youtube paused forgetting about it, to be religious about using the "turn of the screen" trick when they are afk every single time, and other safe use practices I use on my 48 CX - so I'd always be concerned in the back of my mind.. At my pc, it's just me in control of the usage practices and I also generally don't fall asleep at my pc.

Considering that, I'm probably going to buy the best reasonable FALD VA that compares to OLED which is currently the QN90A Neo "QLED" (75" version). It only has one hdmi 2.1 120hz VRR port but that's enough for one console or one pc so should be good enough if I ever get a PS5 or if I ever decide to run a pc hdmi 2.1 gpu's cable to the big tv someday. I don't think the tv does 24hz content x5 on the 120hz port for movies by default (not certain) .. but if it did I could just use a hdmi 2.1 console for streaming apps or whenever a hdmi 2.1 nvidia shield gets released. You could use the smart tv versions if they worked well enough but notably the ethernet port on the samsung is 10/100 and not gigabit though.. just like the LG OLED's ethernet..

https://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/samsung/qn90a-qled

If you get the QN90A, definitely let us know how it compares to the CX. In another thread here, one member said that he bought a C1 and returned it. Some time afterwards, he ended up buying a QN90A and claims that blacks on it were just as black as the C1. I am extremely skeptical of that and you've had way more time with your CX by now, so I'd be very curious to know how the QN90A stacks up against the LG OLED TVs in that regard as well as all other aspects. Not that I am looking to make the switch; I just keep hearing that the newer top-end LCDs are extremely good and I'd like to know if the best of them can indeed match or beat an OLED. I don't doubt at all that some of them are very good, but I've never gotten anywhere close to OLED blacks from an LCD. I also haven't used a high-end LCD since Samsung's 2015 quantum dot flagship, though, and I figure that things may have changed a bit since then.

 

[madpistol]

If you get the QN90A, definitely let us know how it compares to the CX. In another thread here, one member said that he bought a C1 and returned it. Some time afterwards, he ended up buying a QN90A and claims that blacks on it were just as black as the C1. I am extremely skeptical of that and you've had way more time with your CX by now, so I'd be very curious to know how the QN90A stacks up against the LG OLED TVs in that regard as well as all other aspects. Not that I am looking to make the switch; I just keep hearing that the newer top-end LCDs are extremely good and I'd like to know if the best of them can indeed match or beat an OLED. I don't doubt at all that some of them are very good, but I've never gotten anywhere close to OLED blacks from an LCD. I also haven't used a high-end LCD since Samsung's 2015 quantum dot flagship, though, and I figure that things may have changed a bit since then.

I've got a Q90R which is a few models old now, and the blacks are definitely black... as long as there is nothing around it. If you view a dark scene head-on, the blacks look very deep, but if you view it off-angle, those blacks turn decidedly grey. What's worse is that in dark scenes, the picture was very washed out and overly dark. This is obviously not an issue with OLED as each point of brightness is setup exactly as it should be.

 

[Lateralus]

What's worse is that in dark scenes, the picture was very washed out and overly dark. This is obviously not an issue with OLED as each point of brightness is setup exactly as it should be.

I have that same issue with the Sharp AQUOS that's in the bedroom. It is extremely difficult to make out detail in dark scenes. I attributed that to the fact that it's an older panel though; probably from ~2005-2007 or so. Sucks that's still an issue. I'm really looking forward to replacing it with an OLED or some other type of display but the thing just keeps on working. It's been a great set in terms of reliability.

 

[sharknice]

My living room vizio M low density FALD VA tv from late 2015 is on the way out, dying, so I am going to replace it by xmas.

As much as I would love a huge OLED in the living room, I don't think the usage scenario is there for it. It can be a brightly lit room at times with a large/picture window, but mostly I can't rely on or put the expectation on other people to not fall asleep with static material on the screen or leave youtube paused forgetting about it, to be religious about using the "turn of the screen" trick when they are afk every single time, and other safe use practices I use on my 48 CX - so I'd always be concerned in the back of my mind.. At my pc, it's just me in control of the usage practices and I also generally don't fall asleep at my pc.

Considering that, I'm probably going to buy the best reasonable FALD VA that compares to OLED which is currently the QN90A Neo "QLED" (75" version). It only has one hdmi 2.1 120hz VRR port but that's enough for one console or one pc so should be good enough if I ever get a PS5 or if I ever decide to run a pc hdmi 2.1 gpu's cable to the big tv someday. I don't think the tv does 24hz content x5 on the 120hz port for movies by default (not certain) .. but if it did I could just use a hdmi 2.1 console for streaming apps or whenever a hdmi 2.1 nvidia shield gets released. You could use the smart tv versions if they worked well enough but notably the ethernet port on the samsung is 10/100 and not gigabit though.. just like the LG OLED's ethernet..

https://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/samsung/qn90a-qled

If the majority of the TV watching is done while the room is brightly lit I wouldn't even bother getting an expensive TV. Just get the cheapest biggest screen you can. Samsung has the best anti-glare coating, but it's still doesn't look good in a brightly lit room. The only reason I wouldn't go OLED is price and potentially burn in worries. If you're using the built in apps there really is no worry about pausing on static screens because the screen saver will kick in, but if you're using an external device to watch stuff maybe it could.

 

[elvn]

I've got a Q90R which is a few models old now, and the blacks are definitely black... as long as there is nothing around it. If you view a dark scene head-on, the blacks look very deep, but if you view it off-angle, those blacks turn decidedly grey. What's worse is that in dark scenes, the picture was very washed out and overly dark. This is obviously not an issue with OLED as each point of brightness is setup exactly as it should be.

The black areas will be black like you said but Zones will always have to offset against each other with whatever the firmware's bias is compared to per pixel emissive OLED. OLED just doesn't seem like it would be a good bet for my shared living room viewing. As far as viewing angles goes, I'm the most critical and I'm almost always sitting in the middle of the couch watching head on. Sitting off center is also bad for surround sound.

Rtings Review:

The Mini LED full-array local dimming feature is great. It greatly improves the contrast ratio, making blacks appear deep when viewed in the dark. There's a bit of blooming around bright objects that you may notice if you're sensitive to blooming, but overall, it's not that distracting. It also doesn't cause the rest of the screen to light up as everything else remains black. However, the blooming becomes more obvious when viewing off-angle. The screen is uniform and for the most part, there aren't any issues with black bars, but you may notice some light from subtitles and sources may bloom into them. There's a bit of black crush, but it's only really noticeable with background highlights, like the far-away stars in a night sky; large, bright objects are recognized by the TV well and it makes them pop. Subtitles look alright, but once again, you may notice just a bit of blooming around letters. Fast-moving objects transition between zones fairly well in real content, but it's more noticeable in our test pattern. They also move quickly between the zones, and even though it's not distracting, you may notice how the zones are just a tad slow to turn on and off. We tested it with Local Dimming on 'High', and overall, the full-array local dimming feature provides a nice viewing experience. Despite the Mini LED backlight, the Sony X95J has a better local dimming feature.

The local dimming feature in Game Mode is decent. It looks similar to outside of Game Mode, except the dimming zones look bigger and cause the entire screen to look more gray than black. Blooming is a bit more aggressive than outside of Game Mode, and it could be more noticeable, but it's still good overall. There's less black crush, but that's because the whole screen is just a bit over-brightened. Fast objects move between zones just a bit slower than outside of Game Mode, which could be more distracting. We experienced a strange issue where text in the center of the screen causes the entire top half of the screen to turn on all of the dimming zones. If you notice the same thing, let us know.

So there are some major tradeoffs but still seems like the best option vs OLED currently.

More from Rtings:

The Samsung QN90A has remarkable HDR brightness. Small highlights stand out the way they should, but like in SDR, large areas are less bright due to the aggressive ABL. Surprisingly, real content gets even brighter than our test slides.
We tested it in the 'Movie HDR' Picture Mode with Local Dimming on 'High', and Brightness and Contrast at their max, with all other image processing disabled.
The EOTF follows the target PQ curve fairly well, but the overall image looks brighter than it should be. If you still find it too dim, then set Contrast Enhancer to 'High' and ST.2084 to its max. This results in a noticeably brighter image, as you can see in this EOTF.

he HDR brightness in Game Mode is incredible. It gets slightly brighter overall than outside of Game Mode, except small highlights are more dim, and once again, large areas are also dim. However, because of the worse local dimming in Game Mode, HDR content doesn't look as good and blooming is more aggressive.

We tested it with Game Mode enabled, Local Dimming on 'High', Brightness and Contrast at their max, Color Tone set to 'Warm2', Sharpness at '0', and Color Gamut on 'Auto'. There's a new Game HDR setting that you can enable in the 'Game Mode Settings' page, and this is meant to optimize the brightness according to the content. It resulted in a less bright image than we originally tested, but feel free to enable it if you find it looks better with your game.

The EOTF follows the target better than outside of Game Mode, but some bright scenes are still over-brightened. You can make it brighter by using the same settings as outside of Game Mode.

...

If you get the QN90A, definitely let us know how it compares to the CX. In another thread here, one member said that he bought a C1 and returned it. Some time afterwards, he ended up buying a QN90A and claims that blacks on it were just as black as the C1. I am extremely skeptical of that and you've had way more time with your CX by now, so I'd be very curious to know how the QN90A stacks up against the LG OLED TVs in that regard as well as all other aspects. Not that I am looking to make the switch; I just keep hearing that the newer top-end LCDs are extremely good and I'd like to know if the best of them can indeed match or beat an OLED. I don't doubt at all that some of them are very good, but I've never gotten anywhere close to OLED blacks from an LCD. I also haven't used a high-end LCD since Samsung's 2015 quantum dot flagship, though, and I figure that things may have changed a bit since then.

It might not be until closer to xmas because I want to flip my whole room around and put couch on the opposite wall Moving the surround system and other things in the living room is going to be a pita. I'd like to rip the carpet out and put a new floor in at some point actually.

If the majority of the TV watching is done while the room is brightly lit I wouldn't even bother getting an expensive TV. Just get the cheapest biggest screen you can. Samsung has the best anti-glare coating, but it's still doesn't look good in a brightly lit room. The only reason I wouldn't go OLED is price and potentially burn in worries. If you're using the built in apps there really is no worry about pausing on static screens because the screen saver will kick in, but if you're using an external device to watch stuff maybe it could.

The majority is not in brightly lit room. We often watch tv in the evening and after the sun goes down and blinds are pulled we just use bias lighting behind he tv and maybe a side floor lamp or two, each in line with the wall the tv is near. That or lights out except for the soft bias light behind the tv. However there are times we are viewing in the daytime where the blinds aren't drawn, especially weekends so it is bright then (especially in the summer).

Just get the cheapest biggest screen you can.

I don't want a cheap screen. I want the closest to OLED I can get quality wise as I intend on keeping the TV for a handful of years.

potentially burn in worries

The burn in is the worry on the OLED in the living room and on such a higher priced screen b/c my wife honestly does not want to give a fuck about burn in on a tv and her screen care etiquette will reflect that. Then I am the polar opposite of that - taking extra care that some people who more or less wing it don't even bother to do.

Essentially we both have concerns about burn in but coming from different mindsets. She doesn't want to have to worry about a glass cannon and I want to take extra care with all of my electronics.

The 5yr best buy warranty which covers burn in on the 77" LG OLED is $625 so it's not as appealing as when I got the warranty on the 48" CX to me either. It takes a $2999+tax ($3225) 77" OLED which is just above my ~ $3k window I wanted and ends up being $3850 after tax with the warranty.

So I see a few options:

....Get a 77" OLED with no warranty and end up nitpicking my wife's viewing habits which she would feel she shouldn't have to give a fuck about on a tv.... then if it actually burned in It would be a case where I'd be pissed off that it got burn in and I would end up thinking she is to blame. Meanwhile she'd be pissed off that I bought a susceptible to burn-in screen for $3300 to start with so would feel that I am to blame (which really wouldn't be wrong ultimately).

....prevent catastrophe by biting the bullet and sucking up the + ~$625 warranty cost for peace of mind. <<<<<<

.... Get the best FALD tv I can get in the same near $3k price range and never really have to consider burn in.

The only reason I wouldn't go OLED is price and potentially burn in worries

The 75" samsung is in the price neighborhood that the LG 77" OLED is... about $200 cheaper sticker price. Sans warranty the samsung comes out to be $3010 after tax while the LG C1 OLED with warranty after tax is $3850.


------------------------

Incidentally, my oculus quest (1) just died after 2 years so was outside of warranty. I went through all the support ticket agent's recommended steps but the unit is bricked, stuck on the boot screen oculus icon - so they left me holding a dead unit. I had bought the $450 model that had higher memory and had spent probably another $200 - $250 on quality of life peripherals .. headstrap, different face shields for exercise and padded pillowcase covered ones for other gaming, controller covers, etc etc. plus vr specific games. Now I'm stuck with a brick. The quest warranty is only 1 yr (2 years in UK), so if it dies on you it's bascially a pricey disposable. This left a very bad taste in my mouth about 1 yr warranties.

The LG C1 is also only a 1 yr warranty by default. The higher Tier LG's have a 5 yr warranty but that is probably at least as much as the best buy one I'm guessing in the overall price. Yeah, just checked and the 77" G1 is $4000 + tax (~ $4350).

-----------------------

I'll mull it over some more and discuss it with the wife. I might want to spring for OLED + warranty because otherwise either way (samsung fald vs non-warrantied OLED) I'd be making compromises that I am not happy with. It would take the pricing up a good tier higher than I had wanted to spend amongst all of my other purchases this year though. Maybe I'm just being stubborn about the ~ $3000 price point.
We have a 70" tv now and we don't want to downgrade size wise to 65" either. Modern tv lines force you into a higher pricing tier for 75" - 77" models since they don't offer a 70".

 

[SoCali]

QN90A in the day time with ambient light looks pretty good and I'd say is only marginally worse in terms of contrast. In a dark/dim environment though there is no comparison.

You also have to consider that a QN90A outside of game mode is a completely different display compared to in game mode. I would have personally accepted a 3-5ms input lag penalty for retaining better local dimming or better yet give the user the option of gimping local dimming for input lag / preserving it for image quality.

Samsungs MO the past few years across TV/Monitors has been almost Apple like in that they want you to use their products exactly as they intend without deviation. LG gives the user some flexibility at least.

 

[sharknice]

The black areas will be black like you said but Zones will always have to offset against each other with whatever the firmware's bias is compared to per pixel emissive OLED. OLED just doesn't seem like it would be a good bet for my shared living room viewing. As far as viewing angles goes, I'm the most critical and I'm almost always sitting in the middle of the couch watching head on. Sitting off center is also bad for surround sound.

Rtings Review:





So there are some major tradeoffs but still seems like the best option vs OLED currently.

More from Rtings:
View attachment 400140




...



It might not be until closer to xmas because I want to flip my whole room around and put couch on the opposite wall Moving the surround system and other things in the living room is going to be a pita. I'd actually like to rip the carpet out and put a new floor in at some point actually.




The majority is not in brightly lit room. We often watch tv in the evening and after the sun goes down and blinds are pulled we just use bias lighting behind he tv and maybe a side floor lamp or two, each in line with the wall the tv is near. That or lights out except for the soft bias light behind the tv. However there are times we are viewing in the daytime where the blinds aren't drawn, especially weekends so it is bright then (especially in the summer).


I don't want a cheap screen. I want the closest to OLED I can get quality wise as I intend on keeping the TV for a handful of years.


The burn in is the worry on the OLED in the living room and on such a higher priced screen b/c my wife honestly does not want to give a fuck about burn in on a tv and her screen care etiquette will reflect that. Then I am the polar opposite of that - taking extra care that some people who more or less wing it don't even bother to do.

Essentially we both have concerns about burn in but coming from different mindsets. She doesn't want to have to worry about a glass cannon and I want to take extra care with all of my electronics.

The 5yr best buy warranty which covers burn in on the 77" LG OLED is $625 so it's not as appealing as when I got the warranty on the 48" CX to me either. It takes a $2999+tax ($3225) 77" OLED which is just above my ~ $3k window I wanted and ends up being $3850 after tax with the warranty.

So I see a few options:

....Get a 77" OLED with no warranty and end up nitpicking my wife's viewing habits which she would feel she shouldn't have to give a fuck about on a tv.... then if it actually burned in It would be a case where I'd be pissed off that it got burn in and I would end up thinking she is to blame. Meanwhile she'd be pissed off that I bought a susceptible to burn-in screen for $3300 to start with so would feel that I am to blame (which really wouldn't be wrong ultimately).

....prevent catastrophe by biting the bullet and sucking up the + ~$625 warranty cost for peace of mind. <<<<<<

.... Get the best FALD tv I can get in the same near $3k price range and never really have to consider burn in.



The 75" samsung is in the price neighborhood that the LG 77" OLED is... about $200 cheaper sticker price. Sans warranty the samsung comes out to be $3010 after tax while the LG C1 OLED with warranty after tax is $3850.


------------------------

Incidentally, my oculus quest (1) just died after 2 years so was outside of warranty. I went through all the support ticket agent's recommended steps but the unit is bricked, stuck on the boot screen oculus icon - so they left me holding a dead unit. I had bought the $450 model that had higher memory and had spent probably another $200 - $250 on quality of life peripherals .. headstrap, different face shields for exercise and padded pillowcase covered ones for other gaming, controller covers, etc etc. plus vr specific games. Now I'm stuck with a brick. The quest warranty is only 1 yr (2 years in UK), so if it dies on you it's bascially a pricey disposable. This left a very bad taste in my mouth about 1 yr warranties.

The LG C1 is also only a 1 yr warranty by default. The higher Tier LG's have a 5 yr warranty but that is probably at least as much as the best buy one I'm guessing in the overall price. Yeah, just checked and the 77" G1 is $4000 + tax (~ $4350).

-----------------------

I'll mull it over some more and discuss it with the wife. I might want to spring for OLED + warranty because otherwise either way (samsung fald vs non-warrantied OLED) I'd be making compromises that I am not happy with. It would take the pricing up a good tier higher than I had wanted to spend amongst all of my other purchases this year though. Maybe I'm just being stubborn about the ~ $3000 price point.
We have a 70" tv now and we don't want to downgrade size wise to 65" either. Modern tv lines force you into a higher pricing tier for 75" - 77" models since they don't offer a 70".

Yeah it's a tough decision to make. You can go with an LCD and basically have no worries, but a big sacrifice in image quality, and you're not really spending any less which sucks.

I have a 65" B7 upstairs that we have nothing connected but an antenna, we just use the built in apps to watch netflix, disney+, etc. Same for the 77" GX downstairs. Since we only use the built in apps the screen saver kicks in.
The worst thing that happens when it's left unattended is the receiver connected via ARC auto-powers off which means you have to manually turn the receiver back on or you end up getting sound from the TV's built in speakers.

I also have tons of light coming in from the outside during the day and the TVs still look great, but they look amazing when it's night time or the curtains are closed. Dark room viewing is a night and day difference between OLED and LCD while the daytime viewing advantage the Samsung LCDs have is debatable or marginal at best.
I would feel pretty bad about having to sacrifice the OLED nighttime viewing experience. The only way I personally would consider an LCD is if you know your wife is going to use it as a monitor or abuse it in some way.

If you can stick to the built in apps I don't think you need to worry, I would really push for that if you can and go for the OLED.

 

[Murzilka]

A video from a youtuber about OLED issues:




I do not agree with the conclusion that OLED displays need to be replaced often. I haven't replaced my C7 since 2017 and it gets heavy use almost daily. Except for several months of summer breaks.
I did replaced the panel once, but it was most likely due to the excessive use of the Pixel Refresher procedure from my part. Need I say there was no permanent burn-in for all these years?

The only precaution I follow - no desktop icons and all black backgound. I don't run screensavers and the taskbar is up.

 

[pippenainteasy]

So is there a difference between OLED brightness/contrast/screen brightness on which ones are more likely to cause burn in? I've seen youtube videos where people claim cranking contrast is the worst, some claim its oled brightness, and other claim don't touch brightness and just crank oled brightness. Opinions are all over the place.

I have my screen currently set at 60 OLED brightness, 85 contrast, 60 brightness. Going lower than this seems too dim for me, compared to my IPS monitors.

 

[harvindhillon]

So is there a difference between OLED brightness/contrast/screen brightness on which ones are more likely to cause burn in? I've seen youtube videos where people claim cranking contrast is the worst, some claim its oled brightness, and other claim don't touch brightness and just crank oled brightness. Opinions are all over the place.

I have my screen currently set at 60 OLED brightness, 85 contrast, 60 brightness. Going lower than this seems too dim for me, compared to my IPS monitors.

OLED brightness is the actual brightness of the screen. The higher it is the higher the chance of burn in due to static images.
It very much depends on your room. I have an IPS screen next to mine to display stats and icons, it have it set to 70 brightness. For my OLED I have it set to 25-30 OLED Brightness in SDR and 80 in HDR. My room has direct sunlight though one window but it to the right of the screen so doesnt wash out the screen.

I would leave brightness and contrast untouched.

 

[Lateralus]

A video from a youtuber about OLED issues:




I do not agree with the conclusion that OLED displays need to be replaced often. I haven't replaced my C7 since 2017 and it gets heavy use almost daily. Except for several months of summer breaks.
I did replaced the panel once, but it was most likely due to the excessive use of the Pixel Refresher procedure from my part. Need I say there was no permanent burn-in for all these years?

The only precaution I follow - no desktop icons and all black backgound. I don't run screensavers and the taskbar is up.

Posted on the previous page.

https://hardforum.com/threads/lg-48cx.1991077/page-193#post-1045152114

Commentary on his video can be found in the posts following.

 

[Murzilka]

Commentary on his video can be found in the posts following.

Nice. 👍 🙃

 

[elvn]

I have a little time to figure it out which TV I go with because I have to redo the whole room and I'm in the middle of other projects at the moment. I think one of the reasons the vizio FALD is dying after 5 - 6 yrs is that it was on "all of the time". Working from home with it on, sleeping with it on in a times and out of sleep after work, leaving it on while cooking and eating etc. Also us having different schedules sometimes so having it on one after the other, etc.. It got a lot of on time.

However the thing that really beat it up is that I had it's back facing the picture window. It would get very hot with the sun cycle and then cool off with the air vents behind it in the floor shooting cold central AC air up. Also when the room cooled as the sun went down. I could hear the housing of the TV actually pop at times. A black rear housing facing direct sunlight was not a good room plan in hindsight. I did it that way in order to avoid the direct sunlight hitting the face of the screen though. Heat like that is bad on any tv and would be worse on an oled's organics vs burn in.

So no matter what I choose I will need to swap my huge sectional couch and long same-height hutches I set behind it along with a few other things to the window wall and move my large low-bench style tv stand and my whole surround system around to the other wall where the couch is now. I'll have to use the vertical blinds on the big window that will end up behind the couch more to control the light.

---------------------------------

Regarding the HDR/ OLED brightness convo going on:

Having my first HDR screen in getting my 48CX OLED at my pc, I prioritize getting and playing well implemented HDR games. I also use reshade with a fakeHDR filter and a lightroom filter to push SDR games into higher color volumes and black depths. Windows 11 will do something similar automatically, bumping SDR range games into a slightly higher color volume. I also play some HDR movies on the 48cx at times off of my nvidia shield. HDR content loads it's own metadata almost like switching resolution, so it doesn't matter what you set your (windows HDR) brightness to once that content kicks in. If you overrride hdr metadata of a game or movie (in order to watch it in an unsuitably bright environment for example) - you are going to clip or crush on the ends of the scale.

My point is that if you are using it for HDR content you are going to be using high luminance / color volumes which lick the screen like flames even if you have your windows/desktop settings lower. I'm not avoiding that though. HDR is one of the main reasons that I love OLED. I'm just bringing it up because people are talking about keeping their desktop brightness setting lower or lowering it on the TV. Of course my usage scenario is different because I'm not using my oled for desktop/apps. I'm using it for media and gaming and that includes a lot of HDR content. It's been mostly HDR content since I got it actually and like I said I even bump up SDR games into higher color volume with reshade and will continue to do that with windows 11's "auto HDR" at some later date. So almost all of my usage will be HDR and quasi-HDR color volumes / color brightnesses in scenes. That said, in majority of scenes the HDR color volumes are in the highlights and light sources while the bulk of the scene is in SDR color volume/brightness.

 

[pippenainteasy]

Also one major problem I see with lowering brightness on the OLED is the color shift caused by the anti reflective coating on the glossy surface causing whites to look light cyan/greyish blue on the off angles/corners is incredibly distracting in a dark room. During daytime when there's lots of ambient light it doesn't matter much, but during nighttime if I turn off the lights and its the only light source the white to tinted cyan/grey color shift when I look at the corners of my C1 is incredibly distracting. There is some darkening of colors QN85A too on the off angles with whites becoming greyish in the corners but I can just just raise the brightness in a dark room and overpower that completely, and its not as distracting because its more greyish of a color rather cyan/blueish. So using the display at lower brightness means you are unable to overcome any visual problems from the glossy display or anti reflective coating that you normally could just ignore and crank up the brightness on a typical monitor.

So yeah I agree OLEDs make great TVs, but for a PC monitor, I'm actually leaning towards the FALD IPS display for less issues displaying text and also lighter colors like white which really needs higher brightness with a panel like this. I guess if you just run dark mode on everything and never look at white or light colors that's fine, but then you are basically trading off white performance for black performance lol.

 

[elvn]

Or , space and budget permitting, you could use OLED as a media and gaming "stage" while using other screen(s) for desktop/app use. Either in an over/under or sbs setup.

 

[equinox654]

I don't notice any color shifting on mine at low oled light. What I do notice is crushed blacks, fortunately that is irrelevant for my uses. Text is perfectly legible to me as well. Though I did mess will clear type when I got it and I'm using 200% ui scale.

Now days I use solidworks 8 hours a day Monday and Tuesday and the rest of the time it is pc gaming. Also have a 27" 144hz side monitor. I wouldn't mind getting some kind of arm for the oled and another monitor for my cad work. Just to save the panel to enjoy the things I bought it for.

 

[lors]

Also one major problem I see with lowering brightness on the OLED is the color shift caused by the anti reflective coating on the glossy surface causing whites to look light cyan/greyish blue on the off angles/corners is incredibly distracting in a dark room.

I can’t understand in any way where this is supposed to be "incredibly distracting".

 

[pippenainteasy]

I can’t understand in any way where this is supposed to be "incredibly distracting".

That's why we have capitalism, for people who have different preferences right? There are people who don't understand the draw of a Mercedes, others a Tesla. There's something for everyone.

 

[harvindhillon]

That's why we have capitalism, for people who have different preferences right? There are people who don't understand the draw of a Mercedes, others a Tesla. There's something for everyone.

I do notice the tinting towards the edges but thats just because at a sitting distance, the edges are at an angle.
Sitting further away, I dont notice them

 

[elvn]

I do notice the tinting towards the edges but thats just because at a sitting distance, the edges are at an angle.
Sitting further away, I dont notice them

Text is perfectly legible to me as well

I have zero problems at my viewing distance because it's beyond 60PPD.

Pixel density as is perceived by your eyes is relative to viewing distance. Even with a 42" OLED you'd have to sit pretty far away to be at a proper viewing distance.

You have to sit to where the 20/20 vision threshold starts at 60PPD or beyond on any screen or you will have more jumbo pixels and subpixels. People try to use different kinds of cleartype alternatives and more aggressive AA in games (with a performance hit) but it won't ever be as good as sitting at an appropriate distance. I suspect a lot of people aren't sitting far enough away from larger screens which exacerbates text fringing and graphics/pixel aliasing as well as pushing the HUD elements far into the periphery.

For the 48" 4k CX, the 60PPD ~ 20/20 vision threshold starts at 33.5" .. and starts at 1.5' away for 27" 4k. At those two distances the screens will look the same (60 PPD).
If you sit ~48" away from a 48" 4k screen you get into the 20/15 range though and require very little AA. You can even get away w/o AA for the most part if you wanted to.

==========================================

48" 4k at 33" or less viewing distance:
59.3 ppd is below 20/20 vision; most everyone can see individual pixels. You likely need strong anti-aliasing to hide artifacts.
= jumbo pixels to your eyes, bad text fringing
-------------------------------
48" 4k at 33.5" viewing distance:
60 ppd is above the 20/20 vision threshold of 60 ppd, but below the average vision of ~20/15. You likely need moderate anti-aliasing.
= moderate aliasing that can be more or less compensated for with AA (usually at the cost of some frame rate loss) and sub-sampling on text
-----------------------------------
48" 4k at 47"+ viewing distance:
Anti-aliasing is only necessary in medium- and high-contrast areas.
----------------------------------

I typically sit 38" to 48" away. If I find I'm not looking at my HUD enough to my detriment in some games I'll kick back to near 48"
When you sit around the same distance away as the monitor's diagonal measurement you are making a more or less equilateral triangle out of your viewing angle and the screen width. Any closer it's a squashed fat triangle (or pyramid) with a more extreme angle to view the corners which can affect how easily you can view your HUD elements.

==========================================

Viewing distances in regard to a 43" 4k come out to:

-- Less than 30" viewing distance = below 20/20 vision; most everyone can see individual pixels. You likely need strong anti-aliasing to hide artifacts.
= jumbo pixels to your eyes, bad text fringing

-- 30" + viewing distance = 60 ppd is above the 20/20 vision threshold of 60 ppd, but below the average vision of ~20/15. You likely need moderate anti-aliasing
= moderate aliasing that can be more or less compensated for with AA (usually at the cost of some frame rate loss) and sub-sampling on text

-- 42"+ viewing distance = 80 ppd is moderate, slightly above the average visual acuity; few can see individual pixels. Anti-aliasing is only necessary in medium- and high-contrast areas.

==================================

For a 42" 4k the viewing distances are:

--- ~ 29" or less viewing distance = lower than 60 PPD, below 20/20 vision; most everyone can see individual pixels. You likely need strong anti-aliasing to hide artifacts.
= jumbo pixels to your eyes, aliased graphics, bad text fringing

--- Over 29" viewing distance = above the 20/20 vision threshold of 60 ppd, but below the average vision of ~20/15. You likely need moderate anti-aliasing.


--- ~ 41" viewing distance = 80 PPD which is is moderate, slightly above the average visual acuity; few can see individual pixels. Anti-aliasing only necessary in medium- and high-contrast areas.

==================================

27" 4k :

18" and less = less than 60PPD, below 20/20 vision threshold, bad graphics aliasing and text fringing

19"+ = 60PPD+ , above the 20/20 vision threshold, need moderate AA, text subsampling

26.5"+ = 80PPD+ ,above the 20/15 visual acuity threshold, few can see individual pixels, AA only necessary in medium and high contrast areas.

.....