iPhone 5C 16GB to cost $550 off-contract...isn't that a little much?

JoeUser

2[H]4U
Joined
Mar 30, 2010
Messages
3,919
I thought the iPhone 5C line was supposed to be their budget line, no? Am I the only one that doesn't see $550 for a 16GB phone to be a little less than budget friendly?

I mean, you can get Samsung Galaxy S4's for around that price now...you can get iPhone 5's for that much!

Not that I care all that much...just seems...odd. I mean, the iPhone 5S 16GB is only $100 more.

Crazy.
 

nerdydesi

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Nov 30, 2009
Messages
1,093
Apple prides themselves on their very high profit margins, and I don't see that ever changing. :(
 

Dogs

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Aug 7, 2012
Messages
1,141
To Apple, that is 'budget'. Apple doesn't want poor people to be seen with their products. Apple revolves around one thing and one thing only: profit margin. It's the reason they do everything. They want to have an 'exclusive', luxury appearance to their name and product line, so that they can charge more money for the same phones. If there were cheaper iPhones available, then having an iPhone wouldn't mean the same thing status-wise that it is supposed to mean now. Profit margin is the same reason Apple uses near-slaves to build their products, and gets rid of frugal alternatives like the iPhone 5 as quickly as possible. If they kept the iPhone 5, they'd have to either sell the iPhone 4 for less, or get rid of the iPhone 4 and sell the iPhone 5 for what the iPhone 4 is selling for. Either one of those means lower profit margins.
 
Last edited:

nomar

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Jan 30, 2002
Messages
1,404
The "upgrade" price is obviously selling the hardware at a loss. Being able to get a new iPhone for $199 is a very reasonable price, and buying it new (not on upgrade) for $550 seems to be right for me. That's ballpark for what it has been for a long time.

I haven't paid a cent to upgrade my iPhone since the original 4. Bought 4, sold for a price that covered a new 4s. Sold 4s to cover price for 5. Hoping to do the same with the 5s now.
 

Dogs

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Aug 7, 2012
Messages
1,141
The "upgrade" price is obviously selling the hardware at a loss.

Believe it or don't, but that pricing is 'at-profit' for Apple. The phone carriers foot some of the bill for the new phone, in exchange for keeping you on a contract with them for their grossly overpriced service.

Apple isn't selling the hardware at a loss, because high-margin hardware sales are where Apple makes their money. What's actually happening is that the carriers are subsidizing your purchase of the phone in order to keep you on their service. Apple makes the same amount of money whether you buy the phone outright or not.
 

Silenus

Limp Gawd
Joined
Jan 6, 2011
Messages
177
Also consider that the general populace has the subsidy contract model so ingrained that they think of the contract upgrade pricing as the "price" of the phone. Looked at that way the 5c starting at $99 is only "HALF" the price of the 5S!! A cheap iPhone indeed! ><
 

radeon962

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Mar 13, 2008
Messages
1,283
CNN Money coined a new phrase after the unveiling ..... "iPholp".

http://money.cnn.com/2013/09/11/investing/apple-stock-downgrades/?hpt=hp_t3

Worries that the off-contract pricing for emerging markets like China will be far too expensive to get people to buy in a Country where the majority of owners buy off contract has investors concerned about Apple's ability to move the "cheaper" 5C. The US phone marked is heavily subsidized by carriers but not so much in the rest of the world.

Apple shares have dropped 6% since opening today 2% lower yesterday after the event.
 

Cerulean

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Jul 27, 2006
Messages
9,477
Unfortunately, buying a phone off contract won't lower your monthly bill with your cellular plan provider. :( Unless you're using T-Mobile or something. It's really sad.

So basically, like this --

Question: Would I save any money buying the Nokia Lumia 1020 for $800 retail versus $200 with 2-year contract?
Answer: Not really because your monthly bill is the same regardless of which way you go, and not unless you frequently switch between carriers (who does this anyway?) and want to be limited to just the warranty on the device (doesn't cover Gorilla glass shatters, only defects of the product itself).

:(
 

Trombe

Gawd
Joined
Jan 25, 2007
Messages
891
Unfortunately, buying a phone off contract won't lower your monthly bill with your cellular plan provider. :( Unless you're using T-Mobile or something. It's really sad.

So basically, like this --

Question: Would I save any money buying the Nokia Lumia 1020 for $800 retail versus $200 with 2-year contract?
Answer: Not really because your monthly bill is the same regardless of which way you go, and not unless you frequently switch between carriers (who does this anyway?) and want to be limited to just the warranty on the device (doesn't cover Gorilla glass shatters, only defects of the product itself).

:(

Yeah this is still a huge problem in the USA. Its why ATT Next and Verizon Edge suck and I count my blessings that I live in an area where T-Mobile is plenty good.
 

Xinmosni

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Mar 12, 2012
Messages
1,974
Cerulean, you're better off purchasing NIB from eBay at that rate, which would save you $100+ depending on your luck and the color you want. Even more if you're willing to buy used or open box.

Just letting you know in case you're not already on AT&T and looking to buy a Nokia Lumia 1020 like I am. On T-Mobile $30 unlimited text/web + 100min plan and not interested in getting assreamed with "smart phone" $60/mo plans.
 

Cerulean

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Jul 27, 2006
Messages
9,477
Cerulean, you're better off purchasing NIB from eBay at that rate, which would save you $100+ depending on your luck and the color you want. Even more if you're willing to buy used or open box.

Just letting you know in case you're not already on AT&T and looking to buy a Nokia Lumia 1020 like I am. On T-Mobile $30 unlimited text/web + 100min plan and not interested in getting assreamed with "smart phone" $60/mo plans.
Yep, exactly.

I already have a Nokia Lumia 1020 which I got through AT&T for $400 with 2-year contract and insurance. Dropped my phone once, Gorilla glass shattered, $200 to replace it through insurance (better than paying $800 or another $400 X_x). Previously had a contract-free iPhone 3GS for 2-3 years. In the end my bill is about 35-40$ higher at around $135-140/mo versus the $98/mo I was paying for the iPhone 3GS -- granted though that I opted to get the 5GB data plan w/ tethered and insurance for $7/mo extra, but even if I got 1:1 the same stuff my bill increased by at least 10-15$/mo :( oh well, I'm really happy with my Nokia Lumia 1020 ^_^
 

Digital Viper-X-

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Dec 9, 2000
Messages
14,861
you guys make it seem like Apple is the only company that is interested in Profit first.... At least apple stands behind their products unlike some other companies!(Cough Samsung)
 

Dogs

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Aug 7, 2012
Messages
1,141
you guys make it seem like Apple is the only company that is interested in Profit first.... At least apple stands behind their products unlike some other companies!(Cough Samsung)

Other companies offer better phones per dollar, and offer phone to cheaper market segments. Apple's completely out of touch with global markets approach to phones will cost them in the long run. Even their shareholders are unhappy with Apple's approach right now.
 

Zorachus

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Dec 17, 2006
Messages
10,650
Nexus 4 $199, nuff said :cool: deal of the century.

iPhone 5Cheap for $550, not so much :rolleyes:
 

Digital Viper-X-

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Dec 9, 2000
Messages
14,861
Other companies offer better phones per dollar, and offer phone to cheaper market segments. Apple's completely out of touch with global markets approach to phones will cost them in the long run. Even their shareholders are unhappy with Apple's approach right now.

Honestly as far as value per $ that is completely up to each individual user. I would consider the 5S a better value than an S4 even with the added cost.


Nexus 4 $199, nuff said :cool: deal of the century.

iPhone 5Cheap for $550, not so much :rolleyes:


Now that is a good price =p

and yea the 5C isn't really a great deal.
 
Last edited:

Disposed

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Mar 2, 2010
Messages
5,204
Yep, exactly.

I already have a Nokia Lumia 1020 which I got through AT&T for $400 with 2-year contract and insurance. Dropped my phone once, Gorilla glass shattered, $200 to replace it through insurance (better than paying $800 or another $400 X_x). Previously had a contract-free iPhone 3GS for 2-3 years. In the end my bill is about 35-40$ higher at around $135-140/mo versus the $98/mo I was paying for the iPhone 3GS -- granted though that I opted to get the 5GB data plan w/ tethered and insurance for $7/mo extra, but even if I got 1:1 the same stuff my bill increased by at least 10-15$/mo :( oh well, I'm really happy with my Nokia Lumia 1020 ^_^

In a thread calling out the iphone 5c as being overpriced you point out that you spent $400 subsidized for a windows phone. Bravo sir.
 

Cerulean

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Jul 27, 2006
Messages
9,477
In a thread calling out the iphone 5c as being overpriced you point out that you spent $400 subsidized for a windows phone. Bravo sir.
The bulk of that $ goes toward the camera in the Nokia Lumia 1020 making the iPhone 5C's camera sensor look like ancient technology. This is a hybrid DSLR! :D
 
Last edited:

Ocellaris

Fully [H]
Joined
Jan 1, 2008
Messages
19,078
Nexus 4 $199, nuff said :cool: deal of the century.

iPhone 5Cheap for $550, not so much :rolleyes:


Also disappointed in the 5C price. I was going g to get one if it was like $399 or close to it. I already have a 5, I just wanted the colored shell.
 

ComputerBox34

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Nov 12, 2003
Messages
13,543
Why do you think Apple's share price fell 6%?

They think the Chinese are willing to spend the extra money on their phones - the problem is that at the prices they charge, you get people choosing between phones and feeding their families for the month - what do you think they going to pick?

Not to mention - knock offs are a dime a dozen
 

limitedaccess

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
May 10, 2010
Messages
7,594
They are still primarily targeting the NA market and tailoring around that business model.

At the end for most people the comparison will be more like this -

Moto X - $199
iPhone 5c - $99

So it will be perceived to be significantly cheaper to most NA consumers.. Let's be honest he majority of consumers are in the pick a phone off a major carrier mentality. They will not even be considering (or aware of) off contract options and possible price savings.

In a thread calling out the iphone 5c as being overpriced you point out that you spent $400 subsidized for a windows phone. Bravo sir.

The bulk of that $ goes toward the camera in the Nokia Lumia 1020 making the iPhone 5C's camera sensor look like ancient technology. This is a hybrid DSLR! :D

It isn't due to the actual differences in the phones. Phones are subsidized for differing amounts by the carriers. For example the 1020 at launch was only $10 higher MSRP than the S4 but the contract price was $100 higher. The Moto X is lower priced than the S4 by about $100 yet the contract price is the same.

At the moment Apple and Samsung enjoy the most carrier subsidies and they will have an advantage in NA due to this.
 

Disposed

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Mar 2, 2010
Messages
5,204
It isn't due to the actual differences in the phones. Phones are subsidized for differing amounts by the carriers. For example the 1020 at launch was only $10 higher MSRP than the S4 but the contract price was $100 higher. The Moto X is lower priced than the S4 by about $100 yet the contract price is the same.

At the moment Apple and Samsung enjoy the most carrier subsidies and they will have an advantage in NA due to this.

Look at the price of the 1020 right now and think about how absolutely silly this rambling nonsense sounds...
 

limitedaccess

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
May 10, 2010
Messages
7,594
Look at the price of the 1020 right now and think about how absolutely silly this rambling nonsense sounds...

What are you specifically disagreeing with? The Lumia 1020 did have a contract price cut but its MSRP also has been cut to be lower than the S4s.

Why is the iphone 5c cheaper on contract than the Moto X but the same off contract? Why is the HTC One cheaper off contract than the S4 but the same on contract?
 

Dogs

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Aug 7, 2012
Messages
1,141
They are still primarily targeting the NA market and tailoring around that business model.

This is exactly where Apple is placing their focus. The 5C is priced only $100 less than the much, much better 5S, yet because North American customers usually only see the carrier subsidized prices as the real prices, they're looking at the 5C as being half the price of the 5S.

The trouble is, the North American market doesn't 'really' have much room to grow. Most of the people eligible to buy the iPhone on a subsidized pricing model that actually want an iPhone already have one. For North Americans who aren't buying subsidized phones, $550 for an iPhone 5C is not very affordable, and it's not going to attract very many new customers.

Outside of the US, the carrier-subsidized phone is like the automatic transmission; Most people buy their phones unsubsidized, and the iPhone 5C is even more expensive in those areas than it is in the US. At that price point, buying the 5C is no different from buying any other iPhone, so they're not going to attract any real growth in those markets....And those markets are now some of the largest. Apple's phones can't compete effectively in the largest markets, which is why shareholders and business analysts everywhere mock the iPhone 5C and it's supposed 'affordability'.


The bottom line is, people who buy subsidized phones are the people who buy the most expensive hardware, and the most expensive hardware is general the hardware with the highest profit margins. This is all Apple cares about, which is why the non-carrier-subsidized market gets no love from Apple.
 

Bman123

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Dec 19, 2007
Messages
5,087
Wish they would just make a damn 4.5 inch screen iPhone already. I would buy one in a heartbeat but that 4 inch screen is the desk breaker for me
 

Aurelius

2[H]4U
Joined
Mar 22, 2003
Messages
3,966
Wish they would just make a damn 4.5 inch screen iPhone already. I would buy one in a heartbeat but that 4 inch screen is the deal breaker for me

It sounds like Apple wants to make a larger phone, between Wall Street Journal rumors/leaks and Tim Cook dancing around the subject of a bigger display during an earnings call (we won't do it until we don't have to sacrifice battery life, and so on). I suspect that the company just started on one at a point which ruled out a 2013 launch.
 

Zorachus

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Dec 17, 2006
Messages
10,650
It sounds like Apple wants to make a larger phone, between Wall Street Journal rumors/leaks and Tim Cook dancing around the subject of a bigger display during an earnings call (we won't do it until we don't have to sacrifice battery life, and so on). I suspect that the company just started on one at a point which ruled out a 2013 launch.

I fully expect the iPhone 6 coming next year, will be Apple's big update, with at least a 4.5" screen option, and new design of the phone itself, something different than the current iPhone 4 form factor now used four generations in a row. And iOS8 going even further than iOS7 did in changes.

But if they just release an iPhone 5S2 that will just blow my mind.
 

FerraraZ

Gawd
Joined
Feb 4, 2010
Messages
578
Why do you think Apple's share price fell 6%?

They think the Chinese are willing to spend the extra money on their phones - the problem is that at the prices they charge, you get people choosing between phones and feeding their families for the month - what do you think they going to pick?

Not to mention - knock offs are a dime a dozen

And those knock offs run a better OS, Android.
 

vortec4800

Gawd
Joined
Sep 19, 2003
Messages
946
The incorrect assumption here was that the iPhone 5C was supposed to mean 5Cheap. The internals are basically the same as an iPhone 5 but with a bigger battery and better front camera, so it stands to reason that the cost would be about the same as the outgoing 5 model.

I also expect we'll see a larger version next year with the iPhone 6, which follows their standard schedule.
 

silk186

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Feb 26, 2008
Messages
1,626
This phone is completely stupid, from what I understand it is basically a crap iPhone 5 that cost more than an iPhone 5. I don't see many people getting this over than iPhone 5 which has dropped in price and has will be discounted once the 5s is out.
 

Godmachine

[H]F Junkie
Joined
Apr 7, 2003
Messages
10,472
Ever taken a look at the prices of all Apple products at their online store?

Yea. Enough said.
 

Aurelius

2[H]4U
Joined
Mar 22, 2003
Messages
3,966
This phone is completely stupid, from what I understand it is basically a crap iPhone 5 that cost more than an iPhone 5. I don't see many people getting this over than iPhone 5 which has dropped in price and has will be discounted once the 5s is out.

Every indication is that the plastic is particularly well-done -- that is, it's absolutely solid (partly because there's steel inside) and feels good. The iPhone 5c also has a slightly larger battery than the original iPhone 5. I'd wait for the reviews before judging it too harshly.
 

mav2000

n00b
Joined
Jun 10, 2013
Messages
22
I have been using an Iphone 4 for 2 years and the 5 for about a year now and even though its probably one of the best devices I have used I would say that this time the non carrier prices are way too high for me. I think I am going to get a nexus 5 when its launched.
 

Mchart

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Aug 7, 2004
Messages
5,802
This phone is completely stupid, from what I understand it is basically a crap iPhone 5 that cost more than an iPhone 5. I don't see many people getting this over than iPhone 5 which has dropped in price and has will be discounted once the 5s is out.

Except this -is- replacing the iPhone 5. You will not be able to purchase iPhone 5's come the 20th. You will only be able to purchase the 4s, 5c, and 5s. They did this because they can't produce enough of the aluminum chassis for both the 5 and 5s at the same time and have decent enough profit margins.

So yes, it's a crappier 5 from the sense that the chassis is plastic now. The increased thickness of the plastic chassis means you get a larger battery and better camera though. Further, the 5c will be the exact same price the 5 would have been dropped down to as they do with every last-gen model.
 

Dogs

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Aug 7, 2012
Messages
1,141
Except this -is- replacing the iPhone 5. You will not be able to purchase iPhone 5's come the 20th. You will only be able to purchase the 4s, 5c, and 5s. They did this because they can't produce enough of the aluminum chassis for both the 5 and 5s at the same time and have decent enough profit margins.

So yes, it's a crappier 5 from the sense that the chassis is plastic now. The increased thickness of the plastic chassis means you get a larger battery and better camera though. Further, the 5c will be the exact same price the 5 would have been dropped down to as they do with every last-gen model.

In other words, a plastic iPhone 5 for the same price as what they would have been selling the iPhone 5 for.

To be honest, though, I don't think it I buy into the whole 'can't produce enough aluminum chassis' excuse. They have already engineered the process, so it's just a matter of tooling and starting more manufacturing facilities, which they'd already have to do for the plastic ones. They'd also have to put some amount of engineering into designing the plastic case and the manufacturing process, which is something they wouldn't need to do with the original case.

I think it all comes down to the marginal cost of plastic cases being lower, and the physical capital for producing plastic cases being cheaper. Lower marginal cost at the same marginal revenue = greater profit margin, and Apple is all about that.
 
Top