How come none of the mechanical keyboard last more than 3 year, what happens to 50M keystroke guarantee?

Happy Hopping

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My very mechanical keyboard, is a mistake, it's called Excalibur from Tesoro, and it keep failing

the replacement under warranty is from Tesoro, the USB keep getting disconnect, so have to unplug and re-plug

then I use the Cherry brand, this is the FOUNDER of Mechancial keyboard, the creator himself, at the 2.8 yr., 1 of the key stuck

Then I bought an Azio Retro Classic, white leather surface, gold round key mechanical. I start this around Nov. of last year, but after only a few mth. of use, 1 or 2 key stuck as I push down. I have to tab it to have that key bounce back up.

and yet according to so many the keyboard manufacturers, they all said mechanical keyboard guarantee 50 million+ keystroke. That's at least 20+ year.

Is there any good brand name out there that will last 5 to 10 year?
 

sharknice

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I've had corsair and logitech mechanical keyboards and they've never had any problems other than LEDs dying and the wrist rest deteriorating on the Corsair. I've been using a Logitech G910 for the last 7 years and it's basically the same condition as when it was new except for some of the LEDs dying.
In the "how long does a keyboard last" thread almost everyone's experience is basically forever. Are you super rough on your keyboards? I've never used the brands you mentioned, maybe those brands are just low quality. I've actually never heard of them except for Cherry.
 

Happy Hopping

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what's your experience w/ Cherry? as a stuck key in 2.8 yr. is not very good. I don't play pc games any more, so my usage is just MS office and web browsing.

a lot of here at hardforum has a "logitech" thread, their quality is horrible and service is poor w/ noone honor the warranty. I am one of them, I never get any warranty on the mouse that fails
 
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N4CR

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what's your experience w/ Cherry? as a stuck key in 2.8 yr. is not very good. I don't play pc games any more, so my usage is just MS office and web browsing.

a lot of here at hardforum has a "logitech" thread, their quality is horrible and service is poor w/ noone honor the warranty. I am one of them, I never get any warranty on the mouse that fails
Fuck logijunk, shit warranty support, rubbish quality, just a husk of it's former self. I have their old mx700 cordless desktop from 2001 (they go crazy prices on fleabay lol) it still works to this day. Can't say the same for the other 3 mice from them that died after minimal use
 

mvmiller12

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Not sure what yo are doing to your keyboards, OP, but I have been a mechanical keyboard enthusiast since my Model M on my 286. I've had several mechanical keyboards over the years and I've NEVER had an actual key failure on any of them - only cable failures which I have been generally able to repair myself.

Usually when I replace a keyboard, something happened to the old one that isn't the fault of the keyboard itself - like my toddler son destroying my Model M by ripping the keys off and losing all the buckling springs one day (that was a sad, sad day in the Miller household). When I went to replace it, I went K70 Corsair RGB (because I wanted backlit keys) w/Cherry Browns. The cable on those early gen K70 RGB keyboards is super stiff, and if you move your keyboard around a lot (I use mine on my lap) the cable eventually develops breaks on the inside. Corsair won't sell you just the cable, so I had to hack it a couple of times. I have seen a mod where someone just wired in a USB-C jack on the keyboard itself and used a swappable USB 3 A-to-C cable. I have the parts for it but have not wired it up yet - I will when the cable inevitably breaks again. I also have another generic mechanical keyboard using Cherry Blue switches. No problems at all with that one, or my wife's Corsair K70 w/Cherry Blues - her keyboard just sits on her desk. My Cousin replaced his Corsair K70 RGB due to RGB failure courtesy of dumping 20 oz of water into it. The actual keys on that one still work fine, but the lighting is... odd.
 

rhkcommander959

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Never had a mechanic with a stuck button. In all my years of many mechanical keyboards I've had 1 button fail, and I blame the manufacturer as it was a common report that the escape keys were installed wrong. Gskill something...

Spilled some soda on the key?
 

Happy Hopping

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Never had a mechanic with a stuck button. In all my years of many mechanical keyboards I've had 1 button fail, and I blame the manufacturer as it was a common report that the escape keys were installed wrong. Gskill something...

Spilled some soda on the key?
it's the "U" key, you push down, it won't come back up. I don't drink soda. So that's why I want to know, is this a "1 off" thing w/ the Cherry brand, or what is going on w/ the keyboard industry

anyhoo, what brand are you using
 
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Happy Hopping

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Fuck logijunk, shit warranty support, rubbish quality, just a husk of it's former self. I have their old mx700 cordless desktop from 2001 (they go crazy prices on fleabay lol) it still works to this day. Can't say the same for the other 3 mice from them that died after minimal use
exactly. Same here. And some of us talk about it at another thread. There is no warranty, eventhough it says 3 yr.
 

Happy Hopping

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Not sure what yo are doing to your keyboards, OP, but I have been a mechanical keyboard enthusiast since my Model M on my 286. I've had several mechanical keyboards over the years and I've NEVER had an actual key failure on any of them - only cable failures which I have been generally able to repair myself.

Usually when I replace a keyboard, something happened to the old one that isn't the fault of the keyboard itself - like my toddler son destroying my Model M by ripping the keys off and losing all the buckling springs one day (that was a sad, sad day in the Miller household). When I went to replace it, I went K70 Corsair RGB (because I wanted backlit keys) w/Cherry Browns. The cable on those early gen K70 RGB keyboards is super stiff, and if you move your keyboard around a lot (I use mine on my lap) the cable eventually develops breaks on the inside. Corsair won't sell you just the cable, so I had to hack it a couple of times. I have seen a mod where someone just wired in a USB-C jack on the keyboard itself and used a swappable USB 3 A-to-C cable. I have the parts for it but have not wired it up yet - I will when the cable inevitably breaks again. I also have another generic mechanical keyboard using Cherry Blue switches. No problems at all with that one, or my wife's Corsair K70 w/Cherry Blues - her keyboard just sits on her desk. My Cousin replaced his Corsair K70 RGB due to RGB failure courtesy of dumping 20 oz of water into it. The actual keys on that one still work fine, but the lighting is... odd.
okay, keyboard people, this is my current mechancial keyboard, I paid good $ on it. Now, next time the key is stuck, usually it's the return key on the numeric keypad, I'll take a photo to show you as proof. It's not me. I start this new keyboard last Nov., only been 5 mth., it happens to have stuck key since March, a few times, not often. And I stop playing PC games.

 
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Nobu

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I dunno, office is a pretty demanding workload. People often talk about 30-50 words per minute. Well, if avg 4 characters (including space), that's 120 characters per minute. If you were typing 4 hrs of an 8 hr day, that's 28800 keystrokes in a day. If you figure 52 5 day weeks, that's 7.5 million (rounded up) keystrokes in a year. Three years would be 22.5 million -- nearly half of the warranty, just at 30 words per minute.

Now, if you figure you might only spend 2 hrs typing all day, but you're pretty fast at 50 wpm, that'd be 4.7m in 3 years -- pretty average, I guess. If you were not rough with the keyboard, I'd expect it to be in good condition after those three years, maybe some letters rubbed off or the cable showing its age. A faulty switch if you're unlucky.

IMHO, the ones that failed quick for you were either of poor quality, or you got unlucky and received one that was not assembled properly at the factory. The one that lasted 2.8 years was probably good quality, but you just used it until the weakest link failed. I imagine you probably type more than the average person, but maybe not as much as an accountant.
 

rhkcommander959

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I use corsair, ducky, a few of others. But the key switches themselves are almost always Cherry, and almost always REDs.

My main keyboard that I've used since it was new back at the end of 2015, is the Corsair Strafe RGB with Cherry MX Silent Red switches. The keycaps were all doing ok back in about 2020 or early 2021, but a few were worn thin. A buddy got two kits of generic cherry Jelly switch caps in white and in black, so he used mostly black with some white and gave me the mostly white with some black to swap out. Gave me a good chance to clean all the junk and gunk out. I've typed MANY words on it. I've used it darn near every day since I got it, doing many write ups, articles, gaming, work, and so forth without any issues. To put it short I type a LOT, and I do a fair share of gaming so if any keys were going to be getting tired it would be space, ASD, etcetera. They're all still going strong. I also don't bottom out hard on Reds...

Like I said before, I have had a few bad keyboards in my day, but usually they are lower end keyboards that splurged on Cherry switches and skimped elsewhere. Sometimes a key would stop working, I suspect bad circuitry or cold solder joints - bad assembly or component selection. I've also seen thin key caps that disform but usually that wouldn't stop a switch from registering anyway as the depth to register is much sooner than bottoming out.

Either you have exceptionally bad luck, or there is something else going on in the environment. Pull the key cap off and see if there is anything jamming up the actual switch. See if you can depress the cross-hair shank and get the key to register.

Now I have seen those fun round keycaps before, they are cheap all over the marketplace. I'm not familiar with AZIO but the Amazon reviews don't look promising: https://www.amazon.com/Azio-Retro-Classic-Typewriter-Keyboard/dp/B08JY2SWNJ look how many people have stuck/not working keys. Here I'll make it easier: https://www.amazon.com/product-revi...r&reviewerType=all_reviews#reviews-filter-bar

No offense intended, I feel bad if you paid as much as that is going for, but it sounds like you got a lemon. Those key caps aren't very durable, and I doubt the engineering supporting the switches is done to a high degree either. Every manufacturer will have a lemon, so look for reviews before buying, but always take the good and the bad with skepticism!
 

sharknice

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exactly. Same here. And some of us talk about it at another thread. There is no warranty, eventhough it says 3 yr.
Not sure what you guys are doing but Logitech has had the best customer service for me. Some LEDs died on my keyboard after a year, I contacted them through their website, sent a picture, they sent me a new keyboard for free. It arrived within a week of me contacting them. I didn't have to send the old one in or anything.
 

Happy Hopping

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Not sure what you guys are doing but Logitech has had the best customer service for me. Some LEDs died on my keyboard after a year, I contacted them through their website, sent a picture, they sent me a new keyboard for free. It arrived within a week of me contacting them. I didn't have to send the old one in or anything.
https://ca.trustpilot.com/review/www.logitech.com

have a look, 71% review under BAD, out of 1310
 

Happy Hopping

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I dunno, office is a pretty demanding workload. People often talk about 30-50 words per minute. Well, if avg 4 characters (including space), that's 120 characters per minute. If you were typing 4 hrs of an 8 hr day, that's 28800 keystrokes in a day. If you figure 52 5 day weeks, that's 7.5 million (rounded up) keystrokes in a year. Three years would be 22.5 million -- nearly half of the warranty, just at 30 words per minute.

Now, if you figure you might only spend 2 hrs typing all day, but you're pretty fast at 50 wpm, that'd be 4.7m in 3 years -- pretty average, I guess. If you were not rough with the keyboard, I'd expect it to be in good condition after those three years, maybe some letters rubbed off or the cable showing its age. A faulty switch if you're unlucky.

IMHO, the ones that failed quick for you were either of poor quality, or you got unlucky and received one that was not assembled properly at the factory. The one that lasted 2.8 years was probably good quality, but you just used it until the weakest link failed. I imagine you probably type more than the average person, but maybe not as much as an accountant.
no, I don't type much. It's my home office. I only cut & paste econ. report and wall street journal report on a daily basis as a date to date document. So there is almost no typing involves. The only time I use the typing a lot is here and at facebook. The rest of the time, I click via the mouse to different website browsing. On the excel spreadsheet, I keep an monthly expense spreadsheet, so a small amt. of keystroke to type out what I bought from grocery per week
 

sharknice

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https://ca.trustpilot.com/review/www.logitech.com

have a look, 71% review under BAD, out of 1310
I looked up some other keyboard companies on there and they all have bad ratings.
https://www.trustpilot.com/review/razer.com
https://www.trustpilot.com/review/www.corsair.com
The problem with sites like these is people typically only write reviews when something bad happens or when companies incentivize positive reviews.

I'm not saying Logitech couldn't have treated you bad, but they've been great to me.
 

Happy Hopping

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That's right. I personally have a serious problem w/ them as well, I got a $60 mouse, it dies after 2 yr., it c/w 3 yr. warranty, and they won't honor the warranty.
 

Happy Hopping

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I use corsair, ducky, a few of others. But the key switches themselves are almost always Cherry, and almost always REDs.

My main keyboard that I've used since it was new back at the end of 2015, is the Corsair Strafe RGB with Cherry MX Silent Red switches. The keycaps were all doing ok back in about 2020 or early 2021, but a few were worn thin. A buddy got two kits of generic cherry Jelly switch caps in white and in black, so he used mostly black with some white and gave me the mostly white with some black to swap out. Gave me a good chance to clean all the junk and gunk out. I've typed MANY words on it. I've used it darn near every day since I got it, doing many write ups, articles, gaming, work, and so forth without any issues. To put it short I type a LOT, and I do a fair share of gaming so if any keys were going to be getting tired it would be space, ASD, etcetera. They're all still going strong. I also don't bottom out hard on Reds...

Like I said before, I have had a few bad keyboards in my day, but usually they are lower end keyboards that splurged on Cherry switches and skimped elsewhere. Sometimes a key would stop working, I suspect bad circuitry or cold solder joints - bad assembly or component selection. I've also seen thin key caps that disform but usually that wouldn't stop a switch from registering anyway as the depth to register is much sooner than bottoming out.

Either you have exceptionally bad luck, or there is something else going on in the environment. Pull the key cap off and see if there is anything jamming up the actual switch. See if you can depress the cross-hair shank and get the key to register.

Now I have seen those fun round keycaps before, they are cheap all over the marketplace. I'm not familiar with AZIO but the Amazon reviews don't look promising: https://www.amazon.com/Azio-Retro-Classic-Typewriter-Keyboard/dp/B08JY2SWNJ look how many people have stuck/not working keys. Here I'll make it easier: https://www.amazon.com/product-revi...r&reviewerType=all_reviews#reviews-filter-bar

No offense intended, I feel bad if you paid as much as that is going for, but it sounds like you got a lemon. Those key caps aren't very durable, and I doubt the engineering supporting the switches is done to a high degree either. Every manufacturer will have a lemon, so look for reviews before buying, but always take the good and the bad with skepticism!
Case 1: Azio:

so I go thru the first no. of reviews on the Azio, that's exactly what happens to me. I bought it from ebay so there is no place for me to do a review. The item was purchased at Xmas, so I didn't have time to read the amazon review. w/ 77% good x 5 star review, if I were to read it now prior to purchase, I don't think I would listen to it. The reason I didn't read the review is because people who makes wooden keyboard are usually high end co. AT etsy, wooden keyboard goes for $300 to $700, the azio website also appears to be very nicely constructed, but now it is like what those other reviewers said, it's a $10 engg. w/ a $200 price tag. No difference than a scam.

Case 2: Cherry brand
https://cherryamericas.com/products/office-and-home-office/keyboards.html

as you well know, Walter Cherry is the creator of Mechanical keyboard, so his co. has to know how a good keyboard is made. So that stuck key is on him. There is no reason for it. Warranty is 2 yr., and I have passed that warranty period. But there is no reason it should fail in such a short time, I also replied above to Nobu as to how often I use the keyboard.

====================================================

I wrote a different thread on keyboard last yr., as I was thinking getting a wooden keyboard custom made by someone, and was asking what keyboard circuit and cherry keys is the best out there. Because I really expect mechanical keyboard to last 10+ yr. As w/ wooden keyboard, it seems to be sealed, so there is no way to replace the inside w/o mailing it back to the custom made person and it's a lot of work. I wish there is a 1 or 2 top brand name that stands out on keyboard circuit quality
 

rhkcommander959

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I wish you the best of luck in your journey. It's too bad you've had poor experiences...

I'm going six years on the Strafe from corsair, but you may not like their looks. I've had a few versions of k70 and a few others, never any issues. Obviously other brands out there, I've just used that one the most.
 

Happy Hopping

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I have no faith in corsair since the incident of mass failure on their SSD line, when their phone no. ends up in an answering machine, and noone answer the email. To me, that's just another logitech tactics.

their keyboard is 2 yr. warranty, same as everyone else, including Cherry. For the people that I setup their PC, I rather re-try Cherry. For myself, I'm stuck w / Azio in any case. Although I'm shopping for the next keyboard, preferably a wooden full size mechancial keyboard
 

OFaceSIG

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I have a Rosewill RK9000 that I bought specifically for n-key rollover over 10 years ago. Still running strong. In fact, mechanical or not, I can't remember the last time a keyboard failed on me before I dumped it.
 
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The switches are typically so unlikely to be the point of failure that I doubt anything that is happening is due to a manufacturing defect of Cherry, itself. Keyboard manufacturers advertise the lifespan of the switches as a marketing point, but the reality is that they don't do a very good job of making the housing/PCB/rest of the keyboard, so you'll end up with a poor product. That's what happened with my Razer Blackwidow V3 Pro Chroma, and what caused the death of that keyboard was purely corrosion of the PCB components. I de-soldered the switches of the keys that appeared to be ghosting whenever I plugged in the bad keyboard into another PCB, and viola, they worked just fine, no ghost keypresses, nothing wrong at all.

If you're interested, the best way to get a lasting keyboard is to invest in learning how to build your own keyboard from base components (buy the switches, pcb, case, plate, and keycaps separately or as part of a kit), or understand that you'll probably end up having to buy another keyboard after one or two years when you buy an off-the-shelf "gaming" keyboard. It can be expensive in some cases, but you can spend less than what you'd pay for an off the shelf keyboard and get a better experience with a little effort.

In fact, that's exactly what I tried out when I bought an air75 from Nuphy for $109 ($130 including shipping and their $10 discount when you give your email away), a $20 mechanical switch lubing kit from amazon and some masking tape, and I ended up with a far better and undoubtedly a longer lasting keyboard than the top-tier, off-the-shelf keyboard that I got from Razer for $200. That's $150 for keyboard + wireless connectivity, mac and windows keycap layout support, and great feeling typing if you want to put a little elbow grease in versus $200 and no wireless support, bad feeling switches, and no help if you try to get warranty repairs if you go with the Razer.

If you're wanting to take that route, send me a pm and I'll guide you through how I did it myself, as I had some prior experience building and modding standard mechanical keyboards before I modded this low-profile keyboard. If not, I'd just continue to expect to produce e-waste every few years and blowing thorugh another $150.
 

Nenu

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it's the "U" key, you push down, it won't come back up. I don't drink soda. So that's why I want to know, is this a "1 off" thing w/ the Cherry brand, or what is going on w/ the keyboard industry

anyhoo, what brand are you using

Probably someone else spilled a drink on it and didnt clean up well enough. Or you did without knowing, doesnt need to be soda.
Now the remains have solidified around the switch pole.
You need to clean it out, good luck.
 

Mad Maxx

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I've had only 1 mech keyboard fail on me through regular use. It's my Steelseries Apex Pro TKL. For the 3rd time since buying it, back in mid-2020, it just stopped working over the weekend. I sent it to Steelseries for service the previous 2 times, but am done with them and my Apex Pro. I got a Corsair K70 TKL today to replace it.
 

Nenu

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I've had only 1 mech keyboard fail on me through regular use. It's my Steelseries Apex Pro TKL. For the 3rd time since buying it, back in mid-2020, it just stopped working over the weekend. I sent it to Steelseries for service the previous 2 times, but am done with them and my Apex Pro. I got a Corsair K70 TKL today to replace it.

Interesting.
I had a high end Steelseries mouse which failed and was sent a second hand replacement made to look like a new mouse.
This failed spectacularly with both buttons double clicking.
I vowed not to ever buy Steelseries but somehow bought the Apex Pro keyboard last year which has been great.
Now I'm worried.
 

Mad Maxx

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Interesting.
I had a high end Steelseries mouse which failed and was sent a second hand replacement made to look like a new mouse.
This failed spectacularly with both buttons double clicking.
I vowed not to ever buy Steelseries but somehow bought the Apex Pro keyboard last year which has been great.
Now I'm worried.
I loved my Apex Pro even after it failed the 1st time. Not so much after the 2nd and the thrill is gone after the 3rd. Oddly enough, the USB pass-through still worked while the keys didn't. I don't think my experience is common, but I'm not buying another Steelseries.

This new Corsair K70 has similar switches to the OmniPoint on the Apex Pro. My last Corsair keyboard (K65 Rapidfire) never gave me any trouble during its 3+ years on my desktop.
 
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sharknice

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Interesting.
I had a high end Steelseries mouse which failed and was sent a second hand replacement made to look like a new mouse.
This failed spectacularly with both buttons double clicking.
I vowed not to ever buy Steelseries but somehow bought the Apex Pro keyboard last year which has been great.
Now I'm worried.
Nearly every single mouse manufacturer uses the same switches for left and right click. They don't last and were never actually made for mice so the 50 million click durability claims are BS. There are some good videos explaining it if you search around.
 

Nenu

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Nearly every single mouse manufacturer uses the same switches for left and right click. They don't last and were never actually made for mice so the 50 million click durability claims are BS. There are some good videos explaining it if you search around.
I've become very aware of that after suffering the same button failure on my Logitech G502, my latest mouse has optical switches for that reason (Redragon M711-FPS).
The G502 mouse gets its button mashed hard and fast about once a week to keep it going.
 

Starfalcon

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Interesting.
I had a high end Steelseries mouse which failed and was sent a second hand replacement made to look like a new mouse.
This failed spectacularly with both buttons double clicking.
I vowed not to ever buy Steelseries but somehow bought the Apex Pro keyboard last year which has been great.
Now I'm worried.

Yeah I bought one Steelseries mouse the wireless wow mouse. Used it about a year and the scrollwheel, the left mouse button, and the side buttons all died. The right mouse button still worked, but that was it. Replaced it with a logi G502 and havent had a problem since.
 

TheSlySyl

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I've never had a mechanical keyboard fail on me, I actually only have multiple because I kinda got into trying out new switches and keycaps and I actually just spent the last hour watching tv and putting new keycaps on a keyboard that's gonna live at work for the hour or so a week that I actually type at work.
 

SH1

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Wow...I just realized I'm over 5 years now on this modified IBM Model F AT. It's been very solid so far.
 

bananas1

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I have a 20+ year old rubber dome keyboard I can't do without. They don't make them like they used to! In all seriousness, there is nothing particularly robust about the Cherry switches. They are mechanical parts which can fail just like anything else. Some will fail more than others, even the same model Cherry keys will have outliers.
 

StoleMyOwnCar

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I have a Logitech G710+ (cherry MX brown) that's still working to this day, and I'm an incredibly hard typist (my WPM is pretty high, I wager). I also hit the keys very hard when I type. Not even sure how old it is now. I've literally broken its default keycaps... ie snapped them with my keystrokes, so I had to replace the keycaps... The LED controller is kind of messed up because I can't actually change where the lighting is, though... but everything else works and I don't need the LED anyway because I'm a touch typist. I think you're just having bad luck, OP.

Fuck logijunk, shit warranty support, rubbish quality, just a husk of it's former self. I have their old mx700 cordless desktop from 2001 (they go crazy prices on fleabay lol) it still works to this day. Can't say the same for the other 3 mice from them that died after minimal use
That being said, I agree with this, too. Logitech is basically garbage now. I would buy a different brand, but I honestly don't know what to replace them with to begin with. Their mice just seem to be set to fail because they want those returns, I've had them breaking and starting to flake out on me with even more regularity than before.
 

atarione

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stuck keys sound more like a maintenance / cleaning issue / maybe spills?

A high quality keyboard can fail if mishandled /spilled on. A low quality mechanical keyboard may fail regardless of the quality of switches.

This is my own Filco Majestouch2 TKL keyboard which I have had since 2014~ it has been essentially flawless .. however one key did stick at one point due to debris getting into it.. cleaned / lubed it and it was good as new. I clean the keyboard regularly I keep beverages away from it... nothing can ruin a mech keyboard / create a huge clean up hassle like a spilled soda. About 3x times a year I pull all the keycaps and clean them thoroughly and clean the board itself. 8~yrs on this Filco still has a very uniform key feel and operates as it did when i first took it out of the box. I also have a Rosewill RK9000 V2 which is 10 years old it works great as well... both of these keyboards use Costar from Taiwan as the OEM.

filco.jpg
 

schizo

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I had to RMA my Corsair K70 RGB Mk.2 with cherry blues twice so far for repeating keys, and they told me I can't RMA it a third time as it's out of warranty. I don't know if there's a QC problem with this one model or Corsair as a whole, but I absolutely recommend against buying this particular keyboard. It wasn't exactly cheap either, this is a $160 keyboard.

I would buy a fancy mechanical with replaceable switches and double-shot keycaps and all that jazz, but I have a fingerprint reader supporting Windows Hello plugged into the USB hub in the back of this Corsair and I don't want to give that up. Unfortunately most of the other mechanical keyboard manufacturers, even the really expensive ones, don't include a USB hub. Just Corsair and I believe Das do it. So I guess Das is up next.
 
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