- Mar 15, 2017
Hope you like the result so far! I'm eager to hear what you think
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So the top-hats are required in all scenarios...
That's still a bit deep. With SFF systems, desk area is often what needs to be optimized, not height or depth.Overall Dimensions: 181 x 133 x 320 mm (including feet and case shell)
That's still a bit deep. With SFF systems, desk area is often what needs to be optimized, not height or depth.
I also don't think that it is a good trade-off for size and performance to do a narrow case with a PCIe cable on the back. That one is for cases where you optimize for size over performance.
Performance is limited by the size of the CPU cooler, not to mention that you would need a $100 PCIe extension cable or lose performance by using a cheaper one.
And BTW, you should really get yourself a proper mousepad and a saucer. Mousing on that uneven table can't be good, and pearl-sugar and mice sensors don't mix.
Also, please learn the key combo on your keyboard for the multiplication symbol and use that instead of the letter x ! I would guess that it is Option-Shift-' (I.e. Option-*) in Swedish layout on Macintosh.
WOW, just WOW!
This is like M1 2.0 (sorry, I had to, someone will anyway ).
It's only 10.0 litres with a 120x240 AIO solution!
One thing I'd suggest is that you enable pump+res installation for those with custom liquid setups. It should be possible when used with a short/ITX size GPU...
Edit: Also, it would be great if you can enable the PSU to be installed to the top. The pictured orientation makes sense with a rad on top, but for heatsink cooling, PSU exhausting inside the case will only cause the hot air to be recycled by the CPU heatsink. The other alternative is to almost fully enclose the PSU bracket and open some vents on the bottom plate for hot air to escape...
I sincerely hope this becomes successful. There is nothing like it on the market.
Good input. Would it be an "ok" idea to make it available in two versions 1. XS and 2. S/M/L including a TopHat of choice? Hard to balance cost reduction vs. complexityIf one can make a SFF case that fits full watercooling, count me in! I like the TopHat concept, but hopefully it's not a separate purchase and all TopHats come with the base case purchase, as other cases have tried to go for the "modular expandability" concept and failed due to nobody really wanting to purchase additional parts.
I'll look into that. The idea was to reduce complexity in needing a mounting "floor" when putting on a TopHat. Regarding PSU a new solution will be proposed (the possibility of flipping it 180 degrees and closer to the top)No, it seems tophats are all optional. The case without the tophats is complete. If you want the additional volume offered by a tophat, you can get it, is what I understand...
But you have a point with the internal vents on top... Pachalski, I also think it would be better if you can remove the whole vent area there, but just retain the mounting holes as a frame around.
Thanks!Really love the exterior of this case and the great photography on your website.
Any chance you can reconsider the branding on the front?
I think it takes away a little from the overall minimalist aesthetic.
How far along in the design process are you? Kickstarter soon?
Do you already have more pictures of finished builds?
Especially interested in the cable management and the cpu cooler compatibility.
Info on compatibility and temperatures of Noctua L9x65, Big Shuriken 2, Thermalright AXP-100 would be amazing.
The opening behind the board should allow you to use 4mm motherboard standoffs even with m2-SSDs, in case you need the extra 2mm for the cooler.
Lots of questions, I know, but your case got me really excited. Best of luck!
I like the idea of making an A4-SFX with water cooling on top
1) Are those polymer profiles something standard you can buy in meters and cut to your size?
2) How are you going to make the bends of the side panels? Looks like they will need to go a bit up front and back for this radius or your machining will be quite expensive
3) is top mounted usb/hdmi front panel going up with top hats being added or will they have just holes for it?
4) It's quite a lot of precision machining to do with this design
5) top-hats mounting looks like something that might break off in mobile use - is that a target for this case(portability)?
6) What's your target price point? Will the accessories be included in it or cables and top hats will be paid extra?
I really like the external design - good job on that.
Just wanted to know if it's something widely available and standard supply - buying them by the meters in a manner of speaking about it. Usually such polymer profiles are custom made or parts of bigger product so I was wondering if you got something out of the shelf that can be used in chassis.Thanks, love your attention to details
1. The polymer profils might be able to acquire seperattely by the meter, however the ones we've chosen (best sliding vs rigidity performance) to include are made uniquely for us. Just curious: why buying them by the meter?
So you're extruding it out of aluminium blocks on a CNC - won't this be too expensive ?2. Both the spine and the shell are extruded not bent or folded. That improves regidity, reduces conplexity and inproves production efficemcy at the same time. Hoppfullt a key sellingpoint for Ghost compared to the shaped plate boxes we are used to
I think that it might not fit within the lowest tophat then - on the render front panel pcb looks a lot bigger than 14mm.3.yep, that's the idea. Same panel moved up a notch
6. We are aiming for a price point close to our competitors. However early birds on Kickstarter will be offered a price significally bellow retail price. TopHats are a small extra or as a bundle.
So you're extruding it out of aluminium blocks on a CNC - won't this be too expensive ?
I think that it might not fit within the lowest tophat then - on the render front panel pcb looks a lot bigger than 14mm.
Oh, then I understand your concern I mean that we are extruding them, pushing heated aluminum though a die - just like you do with an aluminium profile. The result is a 50 meter long pipe/profile that is cut in the right length and then only the holes are CNCd
Doesn't top-hat block the ability to slide the side panel from the top? How are you going to secure those screws from the inside with panels installed?when putting on the S TopHat the panel will cover half on the TopHat and half on the spine (that is somewhat true for the M TopHat aswell actually)
Hope to publish rendering and live footage of details shortly (understand that its hard to see the complete design on the pics I shared) but meanwhile: the tophat is fixated to the shell with screws on the sides and in the top of the core there is a gap in which the usb/pwr panel can slide.Awesome, I didn't think about this. So the panels can be made pretty quickly then. The frame however still need a lot of CNC'in though.
Doesn't top-hat block the ability to slide the side panel from the top? How are you going to secure those screws from the inside with panels installed?
How is the "hat" secured? I would love to do a watercooled build in this case, but i need to know its secure.
How much weight can they carry? Incase i grab the case by the top.
It's secured with 4 M2 Allen screes in the bortom of the Tophat and top of the Shell (or another TopHat)
How much weight can they carry? Incase i grab the case by the top.
Please allow space for filters between the side panels and fans. One of my favorite things about my Ncase M1 is that I can put Demci flex filters in between the side panels of the case and the intake fans. The important idea here is that the filters are hidden, but can still easily be removed and cleaned without moving the computer at all.
I think this is a good idea because the PSU heat can escape through the top of the case instead of being vented into the inside of the case.
Also, SSDs/hdds on the bottom is better than on top because if they are put on top, they block off the top vents, and would be cooked by all the heat from the rest of the system that needs to go out through the top
In my situation, width and depth are more critical than height. I wonder if I would be able to put some feet on the front and stand it up, so that the longest dimension is the height? (This would leave the "rear" IO panels on the top, but I'm okay with that.)
There are many popular cards that are significantly taller and/or thicker than the reference design. Could your provide a more specific thickness and also the height limits? Various new aftermarket gtx1080ti cards, such as asus strix and msi gaming X cards, are rumored to be 2.5 slot cards. (up to 52mm thick) Does this mean they won't fit?
There is currently a 5 mm gap between the top plane (the platform for creative builders) and the outer sidewall where filters slide in. the bottom is 10 mm wider than the pale above. The spine has extruded slots to guide them straight down, you can pull them out after lifting the outer top off (the one with the rag tag of your choice). Are you saying you want us to adjust this?
Current GPU dimension compatibility
305 x 144 x 41 mm with filter on GPU side
305 x 144 x 46 mm no filter on GPU side
GPU Width compatibility
The current depth of the GPU side of the case is 51 mm, Spine to inside of shell. this is adjustable and the real estate on this side of the Spine is competing with multiple components on the other side. Adjusting this would mean new tooling and some heavy lifting. Frazhna What is your opinion on the distribution here case?
Haha, no reason to be sorry, I'm sorry if a came off wrong and our lack of clarity in the descriptions.Sorry, I guess I misunderstood the design. I just wanted to be sure there was enough room for filters, and it sounds like there is.
Just to be clear, the 4mm MB standoffs that would make the NH-L9x65 possible is not solved yet, the chamber in the corners of the Spine profile are causes the MB back plate to fit poorly with the 4 mm stand offs, still working on the fitt. For now we are at 63-64 mmI didn't realize you already had tooling done. I think the choice of limiting GPU coolers to 2 slots so there will be more space for a cpu cooler is worth the trade-off. Having enough room to fit the NH-L9x65 is a big plus
That sounds pretty legit. I'd love to run a box of that material over with my car (skoda citygo), let me know if you need me to test it, I live in Denmark so I'm closeby.Ok, let's dive down the geek hole for a while
The T6/T6511 alloy that we are currently testing has a Tensile strength of 310 MPa and a Yeald Streangth of 290MPa, so about the same strength as a better chef knife but since we are working with 2.5mm in width these components can withstand significantly more.
This has all been simulated but not tested in reality since all the prototypes have been made with another Alloy so far. But theoretically this means that you could apply about a grown Swedish mans body weight (79kg) (or pull as hard) on a single square millimeter of the cases ametal components (in practice impossible) without it deforming or elongating it.
I'm not sure how to describe the strength of this case better, maybe by saying that in theory an elephant could easily stand on it with it's full body weight on one foot?
- People probably want to use a vandal switch for power on/off.
I guess as a fellow swede I must chime in and say it's looking nice. Though, some thoughts/questions.
Lastly, really good job on this!
- I like the materials and tooling you consider.
- From what I understand, no ventilation holes at the bottom? Wouldn't some holes there help with air flow and temperatures?
- I assume the large TopHat will fit a 240mm radiator? Will you show any example of this? Personally, I am interested in testing a custom loop in this case if possible.
- I see there is some kind of perforated cover on top (58% open area is mentioned). How would this work with the TopHat? Would fans suck air from within the case, through the side panels? I am also concerned with turbulence noise when fans are placed directly in contact with a perforated area. For example, side panel pans on the Ncase M1 suffers from extra noise from this, and also fans on the A4 case.
- Will you offer windowed version for the shell? I think this would mostly be interesting to see a water cooling setup, but then I am concerned with air intake.
- It's interesting that you mention that you can't really hear much from the case during gaming. I assume this is because the thick aluminium isolates quite a bit of noise?
- Good that you consider multiple placement of the PSU. Want to keep that power cord subdued. When on the bottom, it reminds me of the Metis case. However, then it kinda blows the wamr air downward, which goes into the case and becomes recycled.
- People probably want to use a vandal switch for power on/off.
- Regarding branding, I would like to see it quite minimal. Perhaps just like Ncase, with a very small text somewhere. A4 case does not have any permanent branding, which I think many like.
- Vents in bottom are not discarded, but we will need be able to produce some support in the data before adding this change.
- This is actually where the project once started, with the aim to create a solution for a SFF case with water cooling compatibility. Our first ever prototype was a laser cut 3 mm thick aluminium plate that after some bending looked much like the Spine only standing up. I'll publish pictures from this some day. So this has been a defining feature from the start. We have tested nonferrous closed system solutions, never any custom builds (to old for that?). They are all working fine but some better than others. The stiffer the hoses are the tougher it is to make them fit where zip tights are needed to put through the tread holes and hold the hoses in and have them clear the memory sticks. I'll defiantly post some different configurations of this soon. 240 x 120 rads or 120 x 120 have been successfully tested.
- Yes, we are looking into this and will make the changes needed to avoid as much turbulence as possible, currently we are looking at a solution where the open area of this plate is increased significantly. There are multiple purposes of this "platform of creativity" so it wont disappear all together.
- We will not offer windowed version for the shell but we hope to see the modding community handle this
- When I got back into building PCs again my biggest surprise was how quiet all the components were despite a significant jump in performance. In the early days everything was constantly needing more power and made more noise, now it seams lite that pendulum is going back and is now at a point where fresh air keeps everything very quiet. Let us post some noise results for different configurations for comparison.
- We love the solution with multiple PSU orientations.
- Some probably will
- We are evaluating some new design of the front graphics, maybe a vote could help us understand preferences in different markets since this is a less scientific question.
This case has a very high potential for greatness! Guess I'll have to be following this thread along with the one on Sweclockers.
Nah, that would ruin the sleek looks (and should be quite problematic to fit as well, large as they usually are).
Regarding switches. There are quite small vandal switches. For example 12mm ones that people use on the M1.