discussing the warez problem

CyberCRAP

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cuemasterfl said:
It's amazing how many times I read "warez is bad", "you are stealing", etc. The same people making those comments, or a good portion of, are doing it themselves - I would put money on it. They just don't admit to it.

(not directed at any one individual)

Yep and I'm sure they have illegal mp3s on their hd. Oh well it is like speeding, everybody does it and thinks nothing of it. I personally could care less if people pirate software or not. If everybody did then there would be no software. If everybody bought software then there would be no cd burners, dvd burners, huge hds, etc. There are tradeoffs to both sides.
 

Senor Forum

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Senor Forum would like to offer to pay for the surgery to get the stick removed from Scret's ass.

Senor Forum OUT.
 

Munka

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but money is not the ONLY reason people make visits to Uncle Juarez...

let me make an example, coming from a more international perspective since not all of you have left your country of birth......ever.

The rest of the world is very, very different from north america... and in many places....you don't have access to many of the things which are available to you. There are some large exceptions to this, depending on where you go, but still, by and large this holds true.

For example, if you simply could not get a hold of music, games or movies in your language, would you never perhaps even think about resorting to other, more practical means?

I am neither advocating juarez, free music or anything like that, nor saying it is right. I am simply just pointing out an aspect that many of you might not have thought about.
 

KingKaeru

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Senor Forum said:
Senor Forum would like to point out how irrelevant that comment was.

Senor Forum thinks that the company will do just fine.

Senor Forum thinks that 10000000 people could download it, and that Carmack could still afford his precious Lambo.

Senor Forum OUT.

Please speak normally and stop trolling. Of course the company will do just fine because there are a lot of honest people out there who choose to PAY for the hard work that these guys put into their product.

--KK
 

Senor Forum

Weaksauce
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KingKaeru said:
there are a lot of honest people out there who choose to PAY for the hard work that these guys put into their product.

--KK


Senor Forum finds you to be quite observant.
 

FluxCap

Limp Gawd
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Why does id not document the ip address of each person downloading Doom 3 and fine them?
 

loonym

n00b
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FluxCap said:
Why does id not document the ip address of each person downloading Doom 3 and fine them?
On whos authority would a software company fine someone? How would they collect? Would they monitor all irc networks and private ftps as well?
 

cuemasterfl

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FluxCap said:
Why does id not document the ip address of each person downloading Doom 3 and fine them?

How would they? You can't get the IP from the newsgroups. There might be SOME way, like if the program connected to the internet and reported their bad cd key to ID or something (once it is installed obviously), and their IP. But most people now use a firewall, and can simply deny Doom III access to the internet, because they know their Mexican copy can't play over the internet anyway.
 

FluxCap

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loonym said:
On whos authority would a software company fine someone? How would they collect? Would they monitor all irc networks and private ftps as well?
They have plenty of legal right and they would just need to monitor supernova.org to get a lot of the people.
 

FluxCap

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cuemasterfl said:
How would they? You can't get the IP from the newsgroups. There might be SOME way, like if the program connected to the internet and reported their bad cd key to ID or something (once it is installed obviously), and their IP. But most people now use a firewall, and can simply deny Doom III access to the internet, because they know their Mexican copy can't play over the internet anyway.
All ip addresses show in bit torrent clients and id could themselves connect and download Doom 3 and gather their information that way, very easy actually.
 

Munka

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^^ you are a retard.... the world extends far more than just the USA.... and that would require cooperation from international governments and what not, many of which have different systems and beliefs.

edit:message was to poster above you fluxcap, sorry
edit2: oh wait that's you, retard.
 

cuemasterfl

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FluxCap said:
All ip addresses show in bit torrent clients and id could themselves connect and download Doom 3 and gather their information that way, very easy actually.

Yes, with Bit Torrent, but I am betting that most people will get it from Usenet (much faster download speeds). They would have to get the IP information from the ISPs then, and I doubt if any of the ISPs would even care to help ID.
 

FluxCap

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Munka said:
^^ you are a retard.... the world extends far more than just the USA.... and that would require cooperation from international governments and what not, many of which have different systems and beliefs.
I am a retard? Wow, because I am against illegal downloading?
 

FluxCap

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cuemasterfl said:
Yes, with Bit Torrent, but I am betting that most people will get it from Usenet (much faster download speeds). They would have to get the IP information from the ISPs then, and I doubt if any of the ISPs would even care to help ID.
Hey, you gotta start somewhere.
 

steal

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FluxCap said:
They have plenty of legal right and they would just need to monitor supernova.org to get a lot of the people.

so you wanna prosecute every single person who hops on the doom3 torrent?

what about usenet?

what about ftp's?

what about dcc's?

are you sure they're not gonna be spending all of the money they just made off of the game on trying to prosecute every single person who tried to pirate it? :rolleyes:
 

FluxCap

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steal said:
so you wanna prosecute every single person who hops on the doom3 torrent?

what about usenet?

what about ftp's?

what about dcc's?

are you sure they're not gonna be spending all of the money they just made off of the game on trying to prosecute every single person who tried to pirate it? :rolleyes:
No, just torrent first to knock out a good number of people. I mean 60k people is a good number.
 

steal

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FluxCap said:
No, just torrent first to knock about a good number of people. I mean 60k people is a good number.

Yeah? Who's gonna simultaneously prosecute 60,000 people?
 

loonym

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FluxCap said:
I am a retard? Wow, because I am against illegal downloading?
lol what you suggest is impossible and if you can't see it then perhaps you are indeed a bit deficient. Don't you think if it were possible, Microsoft (probably the most ripped off sofware co.) and Adobe (number 2 most ripped off) would be all over this? Coming out against warez is one thing but suggesting that a software maker fine(?!?) people is pretty ludicrous.
 

Munka

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fluxcap I said I was not advocating it in any way.... all I'm saying is you sound like a 4 year old who has one hell of a narrow mind about how the world works.
 

CRXican

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Muttsta said:
I'm not saying warez is right, I'm just saying that its justified
For a kid working at McDonalds $55 bucks is alot of cash to blow on some some
Say this kid buys 3 or 4 games a month, he will be broke!

I just think companies are over charging

Not everyone makes alot of cash, and most of these games are oriented at the younger ages

You are so right, how could we argue against it? I can't belive how weak this arguement is. Do everyone a favor and /yourself
 
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cuemasterfl said:
It's amazing how many times I read "warez is bad", "you are stealing", etc. The same people making those comments, or a good portion of, are doing it themselves - I would put money on it. They just don't admit to it.

(not directed at any one individual)

There needs to be an [H] support group for this ;)
 

Munka

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^^ as nice as that sounds it's against the forums policy I think... not sure

as many people have said, it's a blurry subject. :confused:
 

Staples

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CyberCRAP said:
Yep and I'm sure they have illegal mp3s on their hd. Oh well it is like speeding, everybody does it and thinks nothing of it. I personally could care less if people pirate software or not. If everybody did then there would be no software. If everybody bought software then there would be no cd burners, dvd burners, huge hds, etc. There are tradeoffs to both sides.
Sure, Linux and a bunch of crappy freeware games would be around.

We would still be playing games like the first Wolfenstien right now. That is how fa technology would have advanced and we would maybe have TNT level video cards.
 
I

Ice Czar

Guest
Munka said:
^^ you are a retard
oh wait that's you, retard.

retardation
noun: lack of normal development of intellectual capacities

as in not being bright enough to read the rules

noun: the extent to which something is delayed or held back
as in how the first thought that popped into your brain was not curbed
but spastically posted to the forum like some sort of literary Tourette's incident

noun: the act of slowing down or falling behind
which will be the consequences of further flaming on your part
 

Munka

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very intelligent, in a respectful way...

I am simply trying to make him see that the world is a larger place than he believes it to be and that that is why piracy is such a diffuclt and tricky problem to handle.

Furthermore, he called me a software pirate which is just as bad as flaming so I felt it was justified.

dictionaries aren't the only things that make you wise, you know.
 
I

Ice Czar

Guest
then PM a mod
rising to the bait doesnt cut it
there will be no flaming
and there is no justfication to return fire
 

Munka

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very well then, fluxcap, I apologise.

your warning is taken to heart.
 

FluxCap

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Munka said:
very intelligent, in a respectful way...

I am simply trying to make him see that the world is a larger place than he believes it to be and that that is why piracy is such a diffuclt and tricky problem to handle.

Furthermore, he called me a software pirate which is just as bad as flaming so I felt it was justified.

dictionaries aren't the only things that make you wise, you know.
I didn't call you a pirate so please correct your statement. I believe it was you who flew off the handle first with the insults. I was hoping the posters at HardOCP were more mature than that.
Also, before you claim that you know what my impression of the world is make sure you don't insult someone with several college degrees who has a good idea how many things work.
 

oqvist

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I have a 100 mb broadband connection at my moms house. I have a 10 mb broadband connection where I live. I play 10-20 games a year. Haven´t played a pirated game for I can´t remember exactly but I would recon at least 3 years. The irony is that when I pirated the most (when I started my gaming career) I didn´t even have a modem. And 14.4 didn´t even exist by then. In the beginning I pirated just about every game I played 100 % natural. Doom, Doom 2 you name it. At least it got me into gaming.

First game I bought was Duke Nukem 3D. By that time I had found stores that sold PC games didn´t even know they existed ;) Though I still pirated some games but also bought some. All the games I pirated I would gladly purchase today but never did and never crossed my mind then.

Though games is expensive I spent most of my money on games and a voodoo 2 at that time.

Now though very easy access to warez I doesn´t warez anything at all don´t feel the need to either. You can buy used or games on sale if you want to keep costs down. It doesn´t take long until the prices on games are cut in half or even more. And it feels good buying a game you have thought for. I don´t do burglary or steal stuff otherwise why would I steal games? And you get a lot of entertainment for the buck you spend. Much more than spending it on a day out drinking beer for 50$ or more ;). That is what you can call a steal.
 

CommanderFrank

Cat Can't Scratch It
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Messages
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It's not blurry at all according to the forum rules, it is stealing plain and simple which makes it against the forum regardless what justification you have for downloading a game, playing it and not paying for it. Theft is theft whether it is intellectual property or driving off from a self service without paying for your gas, especially in the view of this forum. I hope that is less blurry to you now. ;)

Munka said:
^^ as nice as that sounds it's against the forums policy I think... not sure

as many people have said, it's a blurry subject. :confused:
 

ruhk

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oqvist said:
55$ is not ridiculous at all. movies cost 30$ and that is about 2 hours of fun. Many games gives 20 hours of fun or even more. And a game that takes 4 years to develop they shouldn´t charge you for it??

Stop pirating games and the prices will drop it´s as simple as that.

Where the hell do you go to watch movies?
 

Munka

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MajorDomo said:
It's not blurry at all according to the forum rules, it is stealing plain and simple which makes it against the forum regardless what justification you have for downloading a game, playing it and not paying for it. Theft is theft whether it is intellectual property or driving off from a self service without paying for your gas, especially in the view of this forum. I hope that is less blurry to you now. ;)


I didn't say that with regard to the forum, I meant to the world outside... though I'd like to think of the [H] as my world :D that really isn't the case...

like I said before, I was not advocating piracy or warez in any way, shape or form.

But really, how can ID claim any jurisiction over people in other countries, fluxcap? it's just not realistic.

edit: furthermore, majordomo, I was not the one suggesting any sort of "Warez Support Group", I was pointing out that this forum has rules which I remain aware of to the best of my ability.
 

oqvist

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ruhk said:
Where the hell do you go to watch movies?

I meant buying DVD:s ;). I live in Sweden so we have taxes too. The most expensive games in Sweden cost about 65 $ but mostly they are like 55$ or less.
 

Impact9

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CyberCRAP said:
Yep and I'm sure they have illegal mp3s on their hd. Oh well it is like speeding, everybody does it and thinks nothing of it. I personally could care less if people pirate software or not. If everybody did then there would be no software. If everybody bought software then there would be no cd burners, dvd burners, huge hds, etc. There are tradeoffs to both sides.
That has always been on my mind. How many anti-warez folks are hardcore MP3 downloaders? We've always hated the RIAA because of the high CD prices. But when that same problem faces game developers we jump on their side. So the basic question that we as a community need to discuss is this... What can we and the developers do to stop warez?

Game developers should take notice of what some music groups are doing. Where you could buy direct from the developer. Someone mentioned the Steam service by Valve software in another thread. Where HL2 could available for legal download, at say $40 and I don't have to wait, Fantastic! The lower prices and fast service are a sure winner for all.

More open and honest reviews by independent sites. I get rather pissed when I see a game that looks good on the box and bring it home only to see it really sucks. For example I recently bought Catwoman. Graphics are great but the controls are horrible. That just ruined the entire game. What do you do but suck it up because the store won't take it back.

Cleaner installing demos would be a nice option. Too many times I've let my kids install games from pcgamer disk. Yes the demos do give a good insite of the game. But some demos are damn sloppy installing and horrible at uninstalling. They slow the computer down and give tons of problems.

I'm tired. Everyone please post your thoughts and try to keep a clean discussion I really don't want anyone to get banned or the thread locked.
 

fallnangl

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Messages
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i c both isdes of the argument as far as buying and piracy not saying that i pirate games which i dont..i believe in buying games but u feel ripped of when u buy anything and its just not what the preview,demo or trailer made it put to be. but is ther nothing that can be done lets say u buy a game hate the crap outta it and and now ur stuck with a $50 coaster or dust collector? but games like far cry make u happy u spent money on games though...Not much u can do to protect ur money from bein spent on crap though..piracy isnt right though u can come up with a million and one reasons to justify stealing anything(and not purchase later).. jus my 2 cents.
 

oqvist

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8,936
I don´t pirate mp3 either? Though in that case since I have never bought a music cd and never will that I could justify I would never by a cd either so they aren´t loosing any money on me. Of course don´t make it right. I have of course in the napster era downloaded some or such but I never listen to cd:s just radio but not very frequently :) Last time I downloaded a mp3 no idea but 6 months perhaps?

Damn I think I am as close as a saint a man can be :p
 
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