Cyberpunk 2077: Night City Wire premieres June 25

ElementDave

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The company said that “an unidentified actor gained unauthorized access to our internal network, collected certain data belonging to CD Projekt capital group and left a ransom note the content of which we will release to the public.”...The hack could be alarming for another reason, in that parent CD Projekt owns the GoG gaming platform which holds the private information of numerous subscribers. However, it said that “at this time we can confirm that — to our best knowledge — the compromised systems did not contain any personal data of our players, or users of our services.”...
(My emphasis.)

That's very reassuring.
 

polonyc2

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After Cyberpunk 2077, it's harder than ever to guess which of these big games will meet expectations

In a year or so, I'm sure some critics will reappraise Cyberpunk 2077, highlighting its strengths without years of pent-up hype coloring their perspective—it'll get the Mass Effect Andromeda treatment, in other words...but I doubt that Cyberpunk 2077 will ever be looked at as a landmark open world RPG in the way The Witcher 3 is...it's just a decent sci-fi RPG that had a buggy launch...

As we look ahead to the other 'big' singleplayer-focused games on the way—that is, games from established studios that fans expect to be transformative—it feels clearer than ever that nothing is a given...

https://www.pcgamer.com/after-cyber...these-big-games-will-live-up-to-expectations/
 

M76

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A lot of words to say basically nothing of value. I can do it in one sentence: We don't know anything concrete yet about the biggest upcoming AAA games.

CP2077 has everyone in a pessimistic mood, and they suddenly think AAA gaming is dead and all future games will be shit somehow.
 

Q-BZ

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A lot of words to say basically nothing of value. I can do it in one sentence: We don't know anything concrete yet about the biggest upcoming AAA games.

CP2077 has everyone in a pessimistic mood, and they suddenly think AAA gaming is dead and all future games will be shit somehow.

Pretty much.

Cyberpunk was never going to live up to the impossible hype and frankly it too long and too many iterations to make for what it is. It's a good game but it didn't pull "a Witcher 3."
 

Colonel Sanders

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I'm glad it didn't. I hated the Witcher3, and 2, and 1.
dh.png
 

Q-BZ

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I'm glad it didn't. I hated the Witcher3, and 2, and 1.

I like CP2077 more than Witcher 3 myself.

What I meant was: Like it or hate it, Witcher 3 had an effect in its genre that other games and IPs took some positive benefits from. Some changes were made that I was grateful for. It set a new bar of sorts.

CP2077 is not going to do that. There are a few tricks in it that I wouldn't mind showing up in a new Deus Ex game (I love these and really, really want a new one) but past that I can't say any kind of new bar was set here in any way.
 

Colonel Sanders

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There are a few tricks in it that I wouldn't mind showing up in a new Deus Ex game (I love these and really, really want a new one) but past that I can't say any kind of new bar was set here in any way.
That's exactly how I feel about CP2077. If you strip away the gorgeous graphics, beautifully rendered cyberpunk aesthetic and pretty good story with mostly well-written characters, you're left with a painfully average shooter with the most basic of RPG elements. I still enjoy the game for what it is, but it *certainly* did not raise the bar in any aspect.
 

polonyc2

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That's exactly how I feel about CP2077. If you strip away the gorgeous graphics, beautifully rendered cyberpunk aesthetic and pretty good story with mostly well-written characters, you're left with a painfully average shooter with the most basic of RPG elements. I still enjoy the game for what it is, but it *certainly* did not raise the bar in any aspect.

I think that's exactly what most people are saying...good game but far from groundbreaking...didn't live up to the 7 years of hype...outside of bug fixes I wonder if CDPR can actually improve the gameplay or add additional content and features through DLC or maybe a Witcher style Enhanced Edition...I would bet on a CP2077 Enhanced Edition in 2022
 
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M76

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That's exactly how I feel about CP2077. If you strip away the gorgeous graphics, beautifully rendered cyberpunk aesthetic and pretty good story with mostly well-written characters, you're left with a painfully average shooter with the most basic of RPG elements. I still enjoy the game for what it is, but it *certainly* did not raise the bar in any aspect.
I think it's the exact opposite. It's a surprisingly good, dare I say brilliant shooter, with just enough RPG elements to not make it an ARPG but still remain an immersive sim.

The story is however shallow and painfully average, and without resolution or proper epilogue. Also they dropped the ball on the amount of interaction with characters. You can't really get attached to any of them as there is just not enough content for it. By the time you start to like someone bam their arc is over and they are never to be interacted with again. Unlike in Mass Effect where even after finishing a character's arc you get to interact with them after each mission, discussing events, getting their views on the situation. Plus of course they are on your team so you always get their banter during missions.
CP has none of that. It's basically a string of teaser trailers of what could've been had they managed to fill the world with meaningful content instead of throwaway merc gigs.
 

M76

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CP2077 is not going to do that. There are a few tricks in it that I wouldn't mind showing up in a new Deus Ex game (I love these and really, really want a new one) but past that I can't say any kind of new bar was set here in any way.
CP2077 does DeusEx better than either Human Revolution or Mankind Divided did gameplay wise. And it does raise the bar on the level of detail in the environment, the graphics, the driving mechanics, the density of crowds.
 
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Island

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Well, a little over 12 hours in. Finally stopped obsessing on what attributes to pick and just went with it and played the game. Going full on tech and guns/blades as I find this way more fun then hacking/net-runner. I know Hacking is OP but seems boring and the mini games put me off a bit. I haven't had any crazy bugs and I really am enjoying the game/story and taking my time. Don't know why this game gets so much hate? I really am enjoying my playthrough and am gonna take it slow and enjoy the ride!
 

Q-BZ

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CP2077 does DeusEx better than either Human Revolution or Mankind Divided did gameplay wise. And it does raise the bar on the level of detail in the environment, the graphics, the driving mechanics, the density of crowds.

I definitely had some "pretend this is Deus Ex 3" moments for sure.
 

M76

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better then Assassin's Creed: Unity?
Sorry, never played it. But definitely better than origins, odyssey, or valhalla. More diverse too. Much more varied, many walking animations, activities. It feels much more real, than any of those games, where crowds just seem like zombies walking.
 
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Dan_D

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I think it's the exact opposite. It's a surprisingly good, dare I say brilliant shooter, with just enough RPG elements to not make it an ARPG but still remain an immersive sim.

The story is however shallow and painfully average, and without resolution or proper epilogue. Also they dropped the ball on the amount of interaction with characters. You can't really get attached to any of them as there is just not enough content for it. By the time you start to like someone bam their arc is over and they are never to be interacted with again. Unlike in Mass Effect where even after finishing a character's arc you get to interact with them after each mission, discussing events, getting their views on the situation. Plus of course they are on your team so you always get their banter during missions.
CP has none of that. It's basically a string of teaser trailers of what could've been had they managed to fill the world with meaningful content instead of throwaway merc gigs.

I rarely agree with you, but I do mostly agree in this case. I wouldn't go so far as to call Cyberpunk 2077 a brilliant shooter. It's got way too many balance issues with weapons, abilities and gear to get away with being called that. It is what I'd call a competent and decent shooter. I obviously enjoyed it quite a bit given the hours I put into it. Cyberpunk 2077 isn't what I'd call an immersive sim. It certainly has the foundation for that, but as people are quick to point out your interaction with the environment is far too limited to be anywhere near a cyberpunk sim, which is what a lot of people seemed to be expecting.

That said, while I think I enjoyed the story a bit more than you but I'd agree with it being somewhat shallow and largely unsatisfying. The lack of branching quests also destroys any potential replay value which is a huge shame. You are spot on about the NPC's save for perhaps Panam which is the only one that seems to have any work put into her. She's also the only one who can show back up at the game's end in any meaningful capacity. The side quests on the other hand are largely well written and while some are certainly throwaways, many of them are quite good. But, complaints others have made about these ruining the sense of urgency one might get from the main story are spot on.
 
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Flogger23m

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I'm glad it didn't. I hated the Witcher3, and 2, and 1.

As much as I think those games were overrated and underwhelming, I objectively think Witcher 3 was better for its time than Cyberpunk in a few ways. I still preferred Cyberpunk over it by a good margin because it was funner. Witcher 3 simply had better story build up and focus. Even then, it often ran off on tangents and had bad sudden exposition dumps and vagueness. So far I'm not convinced CD Projekt can write and pace a great game story. Who knows what they might do in the future though.
 

M76

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I rarely agree with you, but I do mostly agree in this case.
Because you make it your purpose to find some technicality to disagree over even where there is no disagreement. Like you are doing it now too.
But, complaints others have made about these ruining the sense of urgency one might get from the main story are spot on.
Not others.


Panam is the longest sidequest, plus you have duo missions with her, so it's a longer interaction. But after you get the tank scene, that too fizzles out to nothing, you can't even say a word to her until the ending.
I still somehow preferred River's sidequest over Panam's. Those being the only two quests in the entire game that actually have an acceptable conclusion.
 

M76

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As much as I think those games were overrated and underwhelming, I objectively think Witcher 3 was better for its time than Cyberpunk in a few ways. I still preferred Cyberpunk over it by a good margin because it was funner. Witcher 3 simply had better story build up and focus. Even then, it often ran off on tangents and had bad sudden exposition dumps and vagueness. So far I'm not convinced CD Projekt can write and pace a great game story. Who knows what they might do in the future though.
I never got as far in the story of Witcher3 to have a meaningful opinion on it, so I always took the fans word for CDPR's ability to write a great story. But now after playing cyberpunk I'm starting to suspect Witcher3 was overrated in the story department as well.
 

Drexion

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better then Assassin's Creed: Unity?
Unity is still king when it comes to crowd tech/crowd density/crowd AI - the pc version of that game is still the pinnacle of crowd tech in videogames. However, what CP2077 brings to the table is vertical density and much higher quality assets/characters/volumetric lighting. In CP2077 you could be standing in a highly dense market, go one floor up into a highly dense shopping area, then one floor up into a highly dense club, then another floor up into a highly dense apartment complex, then go another floor up into penthouses, suites, residences, etc all packed with npcs, high poly assets, volumetric clouds, particle effects, and high quality lighting affecting all of them simultaneously.

Unity still has the edge when it comes to crowd tech, what they did in that game was amazing, but cp2077 has the edge when it comes to 'verticality' and much higher quality of the assets, in both the crowds and environments.

Edit: I expect both these games to be surpassed this generation, once developers stop support for the last gen consoles.
 

Dan_D

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Because you make it your purpose to find some technicality to disagree over even where there is no disagreement. Like you are doing it now too.
Oh no, we disagree on a lot of things.
Not others.
I said others because it wasn't a point brought up be me initially. I hadn't even thought too much about it in the context of Cyberpunk 2077, but in retrospect I agree with the statement. It's something I noticed in Mass Effect Andromeda, but not so much in Cyberpunk 2077. Probably the reason for that is there are some similar themes to some of the side quests that can lead one to conclude they actually intersect with the main story, but alas, this isn't the case and you don't realize that until the end. The ones i'm speaking about concern rogue AI, which is a theme that comes up in a lot of side quests throughout the game.
Panam is the longest sidequest, plus you have duo missions with her, so it's a longer interaction. But after you get the tank scene, that too fizzles out to nothing, you can't even say a word to her until the ending.
I still somehow preferred River's sidequest over Panam's. Those being the only two quests in the entire game that actually have an acceptable conclusion.
The Maelstrom quest in the prologue is actually quite good. It's actually branching and has multiple options that make it play very differently. In subsequent playthroughs I did her missions a bit later in order to "fix" the pacing of this on my own. Obviously, that's not ideal but you are right. She doesn't speak to you very much after the tank mission is over. Although, if you enlist her help at the end you get quite a bit more time with her and the rest of her clan. River's quest is quite good as well with multiple outcomes for it. But it has the same problem as Panam's and its considerably shorter overall.
 

Colonel Sanders

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I think it's the exact opposite. It's a surprisingly good, dare I say brilliant shooter, with just enough RPG elements to not make it an ARPG but still remain an immersive sim.

The story is however shallow and painfully average, and without resolution or proper epilogue. Also they dropped the ball on the amount of interaction with characters. You can't really get attached to any of them as there is just not enough content for it. By the time you start to like someone bam their arc is over and they are never to be interacted with again. Unlike in Mass Effect where even after finishing a character's arc you get to interact with them after each mission, discussing events, getting their views on the situation. Plus of course they are on your team so you always get their banter during missions.
CP has none of that. It's basically a string of teaser trailers of what could've been had they managed to fill the world with meaningful content instead of throwaway merc gigs.
Can you describe what elements of the shooter and action RPG gameplay you thought were brilliant/groundbreaking? Because I see it, it's like:

- open world (good, done before though)
- driving - while fun and well implemented, done in a zillion other games at least as good, and very rarely integrates into the game other than getting you from point a to point b
- FPS shooting with location based damage, damage type, critical hits (decent, done before and better though)
- janky melee combat that does nothing new whatsoever
- janky stealth system, highly simplistic. "gets the job done" but MANY open world games do it at least as well
- upgrade tree (average at best, completely unoriginal)
- "crafting" system which amounts to your average consumables + tiered item + mods crafting.. been done before many times, offers nothing new
- inventory/gear system - nothing new, your standard gear slots w/ mods
- cyberware system.. just a glorified group of mod slots with various abilities
- quick hacking.. simple "spell" system dressed in cyberpunk clothing, nothing special

Remember I'm saying all this as someone who LIKES CP2077. I just think it fell completely short of expectations that it would do something new underneath the story, character interactions, etc. And even there it wasn't amazing.
 
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polonyc2

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Can you describe what elements of the shooter and action RPG gameplay you thought were brilliant/groundbreaking? Because I see it, it's like:

Remember I'm saying all this as someone who LIKES CP2077. I just think it fell completely short of expectations that it would do something new underneath the story, character interactions, etc. And even there it wasn't amazing.

it seems like he is hesitant to criticize the game too much...it's OK to make constructive criticism, it doesn't mean you hate the game...he seems to want to ignore the major issues because he needs to keep up the fantasy that this is some groundbreaking game
 

M76

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Can you describe what elements of the shooter and action RPG gameplay you thought were brilliant/groundbreaking? Because I see it, it's like:

- open world (good, done before though)
- driving - while fun and well implemented, done in a zillion other games at least as good, and very rarely integrates into the game other than getting you from point a to point b
- FPS shooting with location based damage, damage type, critical hits (decent, done before and better though)
- janky melee combat that does nothing new whatsoever
- janky stealth system, highly simplistic. "gets the job done" but MANY open world games do it at least as well
- upgrade tree (average at best, completely unoriginal)
- "crafting" system which amounts to your average consumables + tiered item + mods crafting.. been done before many times, offers nothing new
- inventory/gear system - nothing new, your standard gear slots w/ mods
- cyberware system.. just a glorified group of mod slots with various abilities
- quick hacking.. simple "spell" system dressed in cyberpunk clothing, nothing special

Remember I'm saying all this as someone who LIKES CP2077. I just think it fell completely short of expectations that it would do something new underneath the story, character interactions, etc. And even there it wasn't amazing.
I never said it was groundbreaking. I just said it raised the bar in a few places. Where did it raise the bar? I've listed it clear as day in the same post.

I don't know what did you expect? That it would try to reinvent the wheel and change tried and proven game mechanics for the sake of it? Kojima does that, and the end result is annoying at best.
None of the big issues with the game are related to game mechanics. It is all in the narrative and the unfinished state of it.

What you list are not faults of the game, it is exactly so enjoyable because it uses every good mechanic that I like and implements them well. Don't try to fix it if it ain't broke.
If it was just an "average shooter with janky stealth and melee" as you describe it, I'd never have put 120 hours into it despite the terrible story and lack of meaningful narrative.

I'd like to know FPS has a better stealth system or melee combat than this one? Because if that is true there must be some great games out there I completely missed.
 

M76

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Oh no, we disagree on a lot of things.
You are just afraid to admit it, but our taste in games is eerily similar.
I said others because it wasn't a point brought up be me initially. I hadn't even thought too much about it in the context of Cyberpunk 2077, but in retrospect I agree with the statement. It's something I noticed in Mass Effect Andromeda, but not so much in Cyberpunk 2077. Probably the reason for that is there are some similar themes to some of the side quests that can lead one to conclude they actually intersect with the main story, but alas, this isn't the case and you don't realize that until the end. The ones i'm speaking about concern rogue AI, which is a theme that comes up in a lot of side quests throughout the game.
I said not others, because it was me who complained quite vehemently about that. And I got shot down for it, I don't remember by whom.
The Maelstrom quest in the prologue is actually quite good. It's actually branching and has multiple options that make it play very differently. In subsequent playthroughs I did her missions a bit later in order to "fix" the pacing of this on my own. Obviously, that's not ideal but you are right. She doesn't speak to you very much after the tank mission is over. Although, if you enlist her help at the end you get quite a bit more time with her and the rest of her clan. River's quest is quite good as well with multiple outcomes for it. But it has the same problem as Panam's and its considerably shorter overall.
The only reason I don't count the Maelstorm encounter is because it is a mandatory main story quest, not a side mission. There are also options in the beat on the brat quest. And the beast in me. I didn't particularly like beat on the brat, but it was funny, albeit might not even be intentional on part of the developers that you get an assassination mission in the same warehouse where you must fight Rhino and if you do the assassination first and kill or incapacitate her during it it counts as if you beat her in the fight.
 

Bankie

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I'd like to know FPS has a better stealth system or melee combat than this one? Because if that is true there must be some great games out there I completely missed.

Off the top of my head:

Better Stealth FPS: The Thief series, Dishonored, Alien Isolation, Riddick

Better Melee FPS: Zeno Clash 1 & 2, Condemned, Dark Messiah of Might and Magic, Chivaly, Shadow Warrior
 

Seelenlos

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- "crafting" system which amounts to your average consumables + tiered item + mods crafting.. been done before many times, offers nothing new
- inventory/gear system - nothing new, your standard gear slots w/ mods
- cyberware system.. just a glorified group of mod slots with various abilities

These were some of the most disappointing parts of the game, for me.
Crafting felt unfinished. There just wasn't enough to craft or variations of things to craft.

Gear I would have loved to see more like Star Wars The Old Republic. The gear only affected your characters looks and the mods determined the stats of the gear.
Completely separating the look of the gear from the stats made it much more enjoyable.
You could then craft the mods you wanted to put into the slots to customize things even more
For a game where style was important Cyberpunk does a bad job with the gear.
Shouldn't have to choose between wearing something with poor stats but looks awesome or wearing something that looks horrible but has more mod slots.

Same with Cyberware. Just felt unfinished and lacking. I wanted to become the next Adam Smasher, can't even get an arm replaced. Although looks like mods are working on this.
 

harmattan

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That's exactly how I feel about CP2077. If you strip away the gorgeous graphics, beautifully rendered cyberpunk aesthetic and pretty good story with mostly well-written characters, you're left with a painfully average shooter with the most basic of RPG elements. I still enjoy the game for what it is, but it *certainly* did not raise the bar in any aspect.
At the end of the day, this is how I would deconstruct a lot of games I love. Assassin's Creed, Far Cry... pretty much any Ubisoft game in the past 10 years. I mean, GTA games basically fit that model, albeit with worse shooter mechanics and better story.

Apart from the ascetics, CP doesn't really do anything superbly. It handles most everything well, or at least inoffensively.
 

Dan_D

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These were some of the most disappointing parts of the game, for me.
Crafting felt unfinished. There just wasn't enough to craft or variations of things to craft.
I would like to have seen more clothing options, but pretty much all the weapons in the game could be crafted. There were also random bonuses to some of the guns so that multiple versions could be made if you liked. The regular stats were not random, nor did the different values in the UI count, just to be clear. That aspect of the game needs to be fixed ASAP.
Gear I would have loved to see more like Star Wars The Old Republic. The gear only affected your characters looks and the mods determined the stats of the gear.
Completely separating the look of the gear from the stats made it much more enjoyable.
You could then craft the mods you wanted to put into the slots to customize things even more
Not exactly. At launch, it was a bit different than that. First off, there was and still is gear that lacks mod slots. In the beginning, things like Rakata (PVE) and Battlemaster (PvP) gear had their set bonuses tied to the shell of the armor, not the mod. Furthermore, the cost of removing and slotting mods from the endgame armor was prohibitively expensive. It was over $50,000 per mod to extract them from the original shell. For those not keeping track, that was 19 total mods. That amounts to 950,000 at a time when a million credits was a lot of in game money. If you wanted to be competitive in raiding and PvP, you needed your set bonuses, so ditching the hideous early gear shells wasn't feasible. You were tied to the appearance of some of the worst looking gear in the game. This eventually changed and now there is an appearance tab so you can look however you want.

Although, much of the gear is pretty awful looking. At least, things that don't come from the cash shop are.
For a game where style was important Cyberpunk does a bad job with the gear.
Shouldn't have to choose between wearing something with poor stats but looks awesome or wearing something that looks horrible but has more mod slots.

Same with Cyberware. Just felt unfinished and lacking. I wanted to become the next Adam Smasher, can't even get an arm replaced. Although looks like mods are working on this.
Later in the game when you've got money, mods, and crafting recipes this isn't quite as hard to deal with, but I'd agree that this is a problem as far as the game's design goes. Early on you have to dress like a drunken toddler and it makes no sense.
 

Bigbacon

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the game did more silly side missions though. Delamaine's missions were silly, you had Brandan which was pretty silly.
 

Aireoth

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Off the top of my head:

Better Stealth FPS: The Thief series, Dishonored, Alien Isolation, Riddick

Better Melee FPS: Zeno Clash 1 & 2, Condemned, Dark Messiah of Might and Magic, Chivaly, Shadow Warrior

Best Melee FPS: Mordhau

yeah, I know its subjective, but that game is stupidly amusing.
 

Domingo

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I like the melee combat from Dishonored a lot. I can't think of any FPS games that do it better. I always liked the melee combat from Oblivion and even Fallout 76, too.
Cyberpunk's melee wasn't bad, it just wasn't super fleshed-out. Outside of the boxing matches, I usually just spammed the normal swing attacks. I found that to be more effective in actual battles. I get it, though. It's tough to balance a game where you have a variety of guns that should be 100x better than swinging a bat or machete.
 

sharknice

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Best melee hands down is Kingdom Come, and hear me out... AC: Unity.

CP melee seems like it was done as a side thought.
You haven't played Mordhau then. Kingdom Come's system is absolute trash in comparison.

But you can't really expect that good of a system in any game that isn't 100% focused on melee combat. The Mordhau devs spent years working on just the melee system.
 
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