Apple "Spring Forward" Event

mope54

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of course there is risk

manufacturers don't just churn out a million peripherals and set them on the shelves hoping consumers will come and buy them someday...they have it all scratched out on paper as to estimated market segment, how many units will sell, cost of R&D, retooling factories, etc.

the sooner they have a large player guaranteeing whatever their threshold to overcome that risk to push to market, the sooner they start to launch new products. it's not done on a whim...it's all carefully calculated or the ones who don't abide by that basic business 101 framework will find themselves over leveraged and quickly out of business.
 

heatlesssun

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of course there is risk

manufacturers don't just churn out a million peripherals and set them on the shelves hoping consumers will come and buy them someday...they have it all scratched out on paper as to estimated market segment, how many units will sell, cost of R&D, retooling factories, etc.

the sooner they have a large player guaranteeing whatever their threshold to overcome that risk to push to market, the sooner they start to launch new products. it's not done on a whim...it's all carefully calculated or the ones who don't abide by that basic business 101 framework will find themselves over leveraged and quickly out of business.

USB-C is going to be everywhere. I think that Windows 10 support for it is a much bigger deal than a single Macbook SKU.
 

Henri108

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Plug in power, plug in display, mouse and usb-ethernet port. That's 4 already for a very very basic setup.
Then I might want to use an SD -card to upload my pictures (as a photogrpher I also use CF-cards).
A Usb flash drive, mayvbe a mechanical keyboard for intense writing.
That are more tyan 7 ports total that I would need personally. I normally use a dongle with connectivity for mouse, keyboard and ethernet externally, but it's essential to have the others independately.
I am a big fan of usb type C, and I am glad it's actually being used, but 1 port is not enough and will never be enough.
Looking at the specs I really thought this was going to be priced at 899 or less.
 
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RandemTox

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Plug in power, plug in display, mouse and usb-ethernet port. That's 4 already for a very very basic setup.
Then I might want to use an SD -card to upload my pictures (as a photogrpher I also use CF-cards).
A Usb flash drive, mayvbe a mechanical keyboard for intense writing.
That are more tyan 7 ports total that I would need personally. I normally use a dongle with connectivity for mouse, keyboard and ethernet externally, but it's essential to have the others independately.
I am a big fan of usb type C, and I am glad it's actually being used, but 1 port is not enough and will never be enough.
Looking at the specs I really thought this was going to be priced at 899 or less.

You're quoting desktop-replacement type behavior/connectivity against an ultra-portable.

If you regularly use all those connections you'd just get a USB hub, leave them plugged into that, and connect ONE cable from the hub to the computer.

This is not intended to be a do-it-all-for-everyone computer.
 

mope54

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USB-C is going to be everywhere. I think that Windows 10 support for it is a much bigger deal than a single Macbook SKU.
Of course *you* think that because you've ignored what I wrote and aren't approaching it from the perspective I laid out for you.

manufacturers want guarantees, not the intangible "promise" that an upcoming, unreleased, unforced upgrade on unknown number of devices provides with saying the next MS iteration will (may) support USB-c.

similarly, in app development the raw *potential* numbers are on other platforms but the solid, historical guarantees come from iOS and so developers aim there.

Plug in power, plug in display, mouse and usb-ethernet port. That's 4 already for a very very basic setup.
Do you own a macbook right now? I can't imagine why anyone would plug a mouse into a macbook...that would be going backwards by a country mile. Or even if for some unfathomable reason someone purchased a macbook and then desired to use a mouse with it, that person would use a wired mouse.

MacBook Pro's haven't had an ethernet port since 2012 and I don't think an Air has ever had one. Why wouldn't you just get a Pro to fulfill your needs?
 

Modred189

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I hate trackpads, but I use bluetooth mice.That said the number of such mice to choose from is very small. So, for people like me, it's kind of an issue.
 

mope54

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Why would you buy a macbook if you hate trackpads?

do you guys even use MacBooks? starting to sound like you don't have much exposure to them with the types of criticisms you have toward this one.
 

Modred189

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Why would you buy a macbook if you hate trackpads?

Because a macbook is not defined solely by its trackpad? There's the OS. The screen. The apps, etc.

I had a gen 1 Air, and have since upgraded to a Yoga 2 Pro and my wife has a 13" Macboook pro. A BT mouse was used or is used with each.
 

mope54

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Their trackpad is a fairly defining characteristic of the macbook...
 

Modred189

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Their trackpad is a fairly defining characteristic of the macbook...

"Reading is fundamental."
I said:
Because a macbook is not defined solely by its trackpad? There's the OS. The screen. The apps, etc.

Macbooks are high end high quality computers with many unique qualities besides their interface device. And tbh, the macbook trackpad is no longer all that unique. Asus and Lenovo, among others, have been putting out trackpads nearly as good for a few years. I'd put the one on my Y2P up against an Air's any day.

Maybe you ought to explain why, if I don't like trackpads and prefer a mouse as my primary input method, I SHOULD NOT buy a macbook?
 

heatlesssun

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Of course *you* think that because you've ignored what I wrote and aren't approaching it from the perspective I laid out for you.

manufacturers want guarantees, not the intangible "promise" that an upcoming, unreleased, unforced upgrade on unknown number of devices provides with saying the next MS iteration will (may) support USB-c.

USB-C is a standard that every major player has endorsed, there's no question about it's widespread deployment. This isn't some nebulous or risky notion. You're acting like Apple has put it in all of its devices. And weren't you just saying how "useless" these "checklist" ports were and that it would be rare to connect anything more than power to the new Macbook?
 

workshop35

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Does anyone else get creeped out by the name od this event? Reminiscent of chinas "great leap forward"
 

UnknownSouljer

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Does anyone else get creeped out by the name od this event? Reminiscent of chinas "great leap forward"

It's a common American phrase relating to Daylight Savings time.

There is: "Spring Forward" and "Fall Back" to remind people to move their clocks forward an hour in the Spring and back an hour in the Fall.

So no, not creeped at all. I think you're alone on this one.
 

Liver

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Outside of a very few niche scenarios, nobody's does. That said, I was largely joking.


The biggest issue I have with the new Macbook is the lack of SD card. I can see it on the low res, no-storage Airs. But anyone with a $1300 laptop also has a camera with an SD card to be read. Considering that the ONLY way for these new Macbooks to read one is via a USB-c->USB-A adapter in addition to an SD-card reader, that is a VERY clunky solution.

No. Because of this reason. Doesn't appear it'll fit your requirements.
 

wonderfield

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Maybe you ought to explain why, if I don't like trackpads and prefer a mouse as my primary input method, I SHOULD NOT buy a macbook?
If you prefer mice to trackpads, you'll be in the same situation with a MacBook as you would be with any other notebook: wanting a mouse. Getting a different notebook only affords you the opportunity to use wired mice without a dongle, though considering the Magic Mouse is both A) excellent and B) Bluetooth, I think it's a minor concern relative to other concerns you might have.

I can understand concern over the lone USB-C port, and I think Apple could've managed an SD slot, but I think when you're talking about this class of notebook, I think the issues may be getting blown out of proportion by entertaining unlikely hypotheticals.
 

BiH115

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I've got a 13 and 15 macbook pro retina at the moment (Both Mid-2014's, so the latest). I'm trying to decide which one I ACTUALLY need. I threw the new 12" into the mix, and from what I'm seeing, I'd rather just have an iPad alongside the 15. The 15 is still excellent in terms of portability and battery life, but more importantly, performance (which I desperately need). I do wish that the 15's received the new trackpad with the new refresh.

I think it'll obviously just come down to user needs. The 12 is a great every day computer, where you won't necessarily need to edit heavy applications (though I'm sure it'll do OK with those too for the most part).

If you prefer mice to trackpads, you'll be in the same situation with a MacBook as you would be with any other notebook: wanting a mouse. Getting a different notebook only affords you the opportunity to use wired mice without a dongle, though considering the Magic Mouse is both A) excellent and B) Bluetooth, I think it's a minor concern relative to other concerns you might have.

I can understand concern over the lone USB-C port, and I think Apple could've managed an SD slot, but I think when you're talking about this class of notebook, I think the issues may be getting blown out of proportion by entertaining unlikely hypotheticals.

Agreed. There's no reason they had to remove the SD slot. I'd prefer it, but I'm not OVERLY angry about it. In regards to the magic mouse A) point, I think it's horribly unergonomic...it's a flat, thin shape, and I'm sure it'll give some of us carpal tunnel (faster than others), but the gestures are nice to have on it, no doubt about that.
 

heatlesssun

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I think it'll obviously just come down to user needs. The 12 is a great every day computer, where you won't necessarily need to edit heavy applications (though I'm sure it'll do OK with those too for the most part).

The new Macbook is obviously a road warrior/carry around with you all of the time laptop. Thin and light is a pretty big deal for that kind of machine and I don't think the lack of ports is a huge issue. But this is a machine that starts out at $1300 for it to have fewer ports than tablets at a fraction of the price I think explains why Apple gets criticism for price gouging. And in this case it's not just Apple bashing. Any laptop in the Windows world at this price would get the same kind of criticism with such a lack of ports.

Again not a huge deal but also something that looks to be more about boosting the margins than eliminating "useless" ports. If they were that useless why sell dongles?
 

DarkStar02

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The new Macbook is obviously a road warrior/carry around with you all of the time laptop. Thin and light is a pretty big deal for that kind of machine and I don't think the lack of ports is a huge issue. But this is a machine that starts out at $1300 for it to have fewer ports than tablets at a fraction of the price I think explains why Apple gets criticism for price gouging. And in this case it's not just Apple bashing. Any laptop in the Windows world at this price would get the same kind of criticism with such a lack of ports.

Again not a huge deal but also something that looks to be more about boosting the margins than eliminating "useless" ports. If they were that useless why sell dongles?

Profit margins, that's why. Want to use more than one USB port? You'll need our $79 dongle adapter for that.
 

RandemTox

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I can't think of any scenario in which I'd be driven to having a laptop this small, with this type of processor, in which I'd also be inclined to carry around ANY stuff that needed to plug into it.

I could see maybe a flash drive - but those will either show up with a type-C connector or a tiny $10 adapter will be all that's needed.

Others will differ, but if more physical connectivity is your need then this isn't the machine for you.

It'll be interesting to see where other vendors dongles for providing, say, display port access from USB-C come in at price wise.
 
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In regards to the magic mouse A) point, I think it's horribly unergonomic...it's a flat, thin shape, and I'm sure it'll give some of us carpal tunnel (faster than others), but the gestures are nice to have on it, no doubt about that.



Actually, it's not un-ergonomic. There are two "ways" to have an ergo mouse.

One is the "orb" style ergo mouse, the other is a finger-tip mouse, which is what the magic mouse is designed as. You're supposed to barely, barely touch it, and it's fine if used correctly.

Problem is, if you try to palmgrip that sucker, it's horribly ergonomic.
It's one of those 'you're holding it wrong' kind of things, only actually serious about it :)
As a finger-tip mouser, I find the big palm-grip mice to be terribly un-ergonomic, but there are more palm-grippers then finger-tippers. Doesn't mean a properly designed mouse on either side can't be ergonomic
 
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