And they still wonder why linux isn't more popular.

LukeTbk

2[H]4U
Joined
Sep 10, 2020
Messages
3,013
Also being Microsoft they can (and did) made the version from back when it was not fully retro-compatible included into the Windows installer, which make somewhat sure that it will not be an issue.
 

MrGuvernment

Fully [H]
Joined
Aug 3, 2004
Messages
20,870
The app was Angry IP Scanner. In spite of all the help here I never did get it to work.

Dependencies should be invisible and handled behind the scenes. If the user has to get involved with them it's a deal breaker.
That is on the app maker then, not the OS, for doing a crappy app package or not having it distributed in common repo's. I have the main repo's and AUS repo's and anygry IP does not show up. I do wonder why so many apps still want people to download a .deb / rpm /tar.gz file these days....seems a little, stuck in the past.
 

travm

[H]ard|Gawd
Joined
Feb 26, 2016
Messages
1,865
That is on the app maker then, not the OS, for doing a crappy app package or not having it distributed in common repo's. I have the main repo's and AUS repo's and anygry IP does not show up. I do wonder why so many apps still want people to download a .deb / rpm /tar.gz file these days....seems a little, stuck in the past.
Because it's a pain to package it for every fucking distro. A lot of the time these guys are solo, and typically you're lucky if they get support on Debian, Ubuntu that's on Canonical and screw them.

That's the general attitude on Linux.
 

Mazzspeed

2[H]4U
Joined
Dec 27, 2017
Messages
3,174
That is on the app maker then, not the OS, for doing a crappy app package or not having it distributed in common repo's. I have the main repo's and AUS repo's and anygry IP does not show up. I do wonder why so many apps still want people to download a .deb / rpm /tar.gz file these days....seems a little, stuck in the past.
Is it really that hard to install a .deb? You can do it via the GUI and it's still managed by the package manager:

471fCaT.png


B2OrN3X.png


ALIr7fB.png
 

Mazzspeed

2[H]4U
Joined
Dec 27, 2017
Messages
3,174
Just installed the .deb of Angry IP Scanner on the Pi400 not a problem in the world. Download the .deb installer, open the .deb installer, the package manager does the rest no different to Windows:

QpcUeNN.png


Nlz3aPc.png
 

Mazzspeed

2[H]4U
Joined
Dec 27, 2017
Messages
3,174
Lol, no kidding. I download .deb files all the time to install. People keep telling me not to, but it's a windows habit.
There's nothing wrong with a .deb, don't listen to the purists. A .deb is no different to a .msi under Windows or a .dmg under MacOS and is still installed using the operating system's package manager.
 

auntjemima

[H]ard DCOTM x2
Joined
Mar 1, 2014
Messages
10,871
There's nothing wrong with a .deb, don't listen to the purists. A .deb is no different to a .msi under Windows or a .dmg under MacOS and is still installed using the operating system's package manager.
Unless I'm mistaken, when I sudo apt install a program, it does so from a downloaded deb file, no?
 

auntjemima

[H]ard DCOTM x2
Joined
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Messages
10,871
No, apt is another form of package management. Essentially another method of software installation.
No, no, I know. I meant, when I run that and it has many updates to do it always downloads the files and then installs. Is it downloading a deb file and then running it or just whatever files need updating from within that program?
 

Mazzspeed

2[H]4U
Joined
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Messages
3,174
No, no, I know. I meant, when I run that and it has many updates to do it always downloads the files and then installs. Is it downloading a deb file and then running it or just whatever files need updating from within that program?
Apt will be pulling updated libraries and dependencies as well as the actual software directly from the Ubuntu repositories or the PPA that was added at the time the software was installed using apt. Deb is software that's actually packaged into a convenient installer, generally software installed as a .deb doesn't update along with system updates.
 

auntjemima

[H]ard DCOTM x2
Joined
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Messages
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Apt will be pulling updated libraries and dependencies as well as the actual software directly from the Ubuntu repositories or the PPA that was added at the time the software was installed using apt. Deb is software that's actually packaged into a convenient installer, generally software installed as a .deb doesn't update along with system updates.
Noted, thanks!
 

SmokeRngs

[H]ard|DCer of the Month - April 2008
Joined
Aug 9, 2001
Messages
17,765
That is on the app maker then, not the OS, for doing a crappy app package or not having it distributed in common repo's. I have the main repo's and AUS repo's and anygry IP does not show up. I do wonder why so many apps still want people to download a .deb / rpm /tar.gz file these days....seems a little, stuck in the past.
Instead of searching for Angry IP Scanner search for ipscan. It showed up for me from the AUR, I installed it through the package manager and it works fine on Manjaro. A quick download, fast build and it was done in a few seconds. I fired it up, let it scan my local network and finished the scan in 14 seconds. Not a single issue with it.
 

Mazzspeed

2[H]4U
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Messages
3,174
I also did an 'apt-cache search ipscan' and it's available in the Ubuntu repositories to be installed via apt.
 

Deadjasper

2[H]4U
Joined
Oct 28, 2001
Messages
2,295
Instead of searching for Angry IP Scanner search for ipscan. It showed up for me from the AUR, I installed it through the package manager and it works fine on Manjaro. A quick download, fast build and it was done in a few seconds. I fired it up, let it scan my local network and finished the scan in 14 seconds. Not a single issue with it.

OK, but it makes no sense. The name of the program is Angry IP Scanner, not ipscan. :confused:
 

auntjemima

[H]ard DCOTM x2
Joined
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Messages
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OK, but it makes no sense. The name of the program is Angry IP Scanner, not ipscan. :confused:
I don't disagree with you, that it you shouldn't have to guess at a naming scheme to install something, but on GitHub (quick google) it lists it as angryip and ipscan.

Either way, you aren't wrong that it should be named something resembling itself. But that's on the developer.

https://github.com/angryip/ipscan
 

Deadjasper

2[H]4U
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Oct 28, 2001
Messages
2,295
It's indispensable for me. Gotta have it. When I couldn't get it to install in Manjaro I dumped it and went back to Mint. I believe you need to DL the .deb file to install it on Mint but however it's done it's not difficult.
 

Mazzspeed

2[H]4U
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Dec 27, 2017
Messages
3,174
OK, but it makes no sense. The name of the program is Angry IP Scanner, not ipscan. :confused:
The clue is in the .deb download, it's called 'ipscan'.

It's indispensable for me. Gotta have it. When I couldn't get it to install in Manjaro I dumped it and went back to Mint. I believe you need to DL the .deb file to install it on Mint but however it's done it's not difficult.
You should also be able to open terminal and enter 'sudo apt install ipscan'.
 

ElementDave

Limp Gawd
Joined
May 5, 2013
Messages
364
Unless I'm mistaken, when I sudo apt install a program, it does so from a downloaded deb file, no?
Yes, that is exactly what happens.
No, no, I know. I meant, when I run that and it has many updates to do it always downloads the files and then installs. Is it downloading a deb file and then running it or just whatever files need updating from within that program?
If you're asking whether the software downloaded from a Debian-based repository is packaged in "deb" format, then the answer is yes. That includes any and all dependencies, whether it's a single library or meta-package. Apt doesn't download and install individual files that reside outside of packages. (Technically, apt doesn't install anything; it invokes dpkg, which is the backend that does the heavy lifting.)

A locally downloaded .deb isn't any different from packages hosted on the official repositories. It might not be trustworthy, but the package format is the same. Debian packages are just archives with some additional metadata files (e.g. "control"). A number of command-line tools are available to inspect, manipulate, and create .deb packages — some might argue too many. Any decent GUI archive manager can read .deb archives too (7-zip works on Windows).
Code:
dpkg-deb --contents /path/to/package.deb
dpkg --install /path/to/package.deb
Although these links point to Debian's documentation, most of the information should apply to Debian derivatives as well:
https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/debian-reference/ch02.en.html
https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/debian-faq/pkgtools.en.html
Also worth mentioning: The Debian Administrator's Handbook (Bullseye [Debian 11.x] is stable as of this writing, so the handbook looks to be a version behind.)
 

auntjemima

[H]ard DCOTM x2
Joined
Mar 1, 2014
Messages
10,871
Yes, that is exactly what happens.

If you're asking whether the software downloaded from a Debian-based repository is packaged in "deb" format, then the answer is yes. That includes any and all dependencies, whether it's a single library or meta-package. Apt doesn't download and install individual files that reside outside of packages. (Technically, apt doesn't install anything; it invokes dpkg, which is the backend that does the heavy lifting.)

A locally downloaded .deb isn't any different from packages hosted on the official repositories. It might not be trustworthy, but the package format is the same. Debian packages are just archives with some additional metadata files (e.g. "control"). A number of command-line tools are available to inspect, manipulate, and create .deb packages — some might argue too many. Any decent GUI archive manager can read .deb archives too (7-zip works on Windows).
Code:
dpkg-deb --contents /path/to/package.deb
dpkg --install /path/to/package.deb
Although these links point to Debian's documentation, most of the information should apply to Debian derivatives as well:
https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/debian-reference/ch02.en.html
https://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/debian-faq/pkgtools.en.html
Also worth mentioning: The Debian Administrator's Handbook (Bullseye [Debian 11.x] is stable as of this writing, so the handbook looks to be a version behind.)
Thanks for this!

This thread has turned out to be quite a plethora of information
 

Mazzspeed

2[H]4U
Joined
Dec 27, 2017
Messages
3,174
i must say, with the latest round of updates Konsole under KDE Neon really is fully featured. There's even the ability to add all of your frequently used (or easily forgotten) commands in the terminal software itself:

19618dW.png
 

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