AMD announces Ryzen 7000 Zen 4 CPUs

Blade-Runner

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Maybe I am blind but I am surprised there isn't already an existing thread for this news. Happy to lock this if I am wrong.



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AMD today unveiled its next-generation Ryzen 7000 desktop processors, based on the Socket AM5 desktop platform. The new Ryzen 7000 series processors introduce the new "Zen 4" microarchitecture, with the company claiming a 15% single-threaded uplift over "Zen 3" (16-core/32-thread Zen 4 processor prototype compared to a Ryzen 9 5950X). Other key specs about the architecture put out by AMD include a doubling in per-core L2 cache to 1 MB, up from 512 KB on all older versions of "Zen." The Ryzen 7000 desktop CPUs will boost to frequencies above 5.5 GHz. Based on the way AMD has worded their claims, it seems that the "+15%" number includes IPC gains, plus gains from higher clocks, plus what the DDR4 to DDR5 transition achieves. With Zen 4, AMD is introducing a new instruction set for AI compute acceleration. The transition to the LGA1718 Socket AM5 allows AMD to use next-generation I/O, including DDR5 memory, and PCI-Express Gen 5, both for the graphics card, and the M.2 NVMe slot attached to the CPU socket.

https://videocardz.com/newz/amd-demonstrates-ryzen-7000-zen4-cpu-reaching-5-5-ghz-while-gaming
https://www.techpowerup.com/295134/...00-zen-4-desktop-processors-am5-ddr5-platform
 

Lakados

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This looks more like Zen3++ than I had hoped but it should still be a good chip. The platform options leave me wanting but aren’t the worst, but I expect them to be pricy.

I am excited for a new memory controller the 14/12nm Global Foundries ones are stale and a significant weak point in the Zen 2 and 3 chips.
 

Vega

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"+15%" number includes IPC gains, plus gains from higher clocks, plus what the DDR4 to DDR5 transition achieves"

And that's best case cherry picked. Pretty disappointing, I may stick with my 5900X system for another generation as I'm still GPU and not CPU limited with my 3090 Ti.
 

Priller

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I think they are sandbagging a bit since Raptor Lake will most likely launch first and giving too much away now would help Intel adjust price etc.
 

GoodBoy

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Is the 15% uplift clock for clock? Or because they are hitting 5Ghz?
Hopefully its clock for clock. And if they can hit 5Ghz thats really good parity with Intel.

The pcie lanes will be the deciding factor for me next time i upgrade (still probably 4 years off). The 5800 being limited to 20 was why I had to change course last rebuild and go Intel.

Edit, just saw Vega's post. A bit disappointing, but not really surprising.
I think we've hit the limits for any more significant performance gains from silicon. The reality is we can get 8 years from our systems, if not more. Kinda sad there really isn't anything left to get excited about when a new CPU comes out.
 
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Lakados

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"+15%" number includes IPC gains, plus gains from higher clocks, plus what the DDR4 to DDR5 transition achieves"

And that's best case cherry picked. Pretty disappointing, I may stick with my 5900X system for another generation as I'm still GPU and not CPU limited with my 3090 Ti.
Given there aren’t really any increases yet going from DDR4 to DDR5 it’s going to be primarily from the node shrink. Their gains are pretty proportional to what you would expect going from 7nm to 5nm.

TSMC’s 5nm process wasn’t really designed with x86 CPU’s in mind the fact they managed to get it working without significant yield problems is sort of a feat onto itself.

I am more interested in the new IO die, AMD could finally have something acceptable for the office AIO or ultra slim form factors.
 

Lakados

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I think they are sandbagging a bit since Raptor Lake will most likely launch first and giving too much away now would help Intel adjust price etc.
Intel can just adjust the price, I don’t think that’s it. I’m thinking TSMC 5nm and their designs haven’t been a great fit. Based on the leaks the Zen4 architecture isn’t much different from Zen3 outside of the L2 cache structure. I don’t think they got to be as aggressive with Zen4 as they had planned due to manufacturing difficulties.
I have no doubt they will get it sorted but I’m thinking that we’re going to have to wait for Zen 4+ for that.

I’m thinking this is AMD’s Ice Lake moment..
 

Priller

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Intel can just adjust the price, I don’t think that’s it. I’m thinking TSMC 5nm and their designs haven’t been a great fit. Based on the leaks the Zen4 architecture isn’t much different from Zen3 outside of the L2 cache structure. I don’t think they got to be as aggressive with Zen4 as they had planned due to manufacturing difficulties.
I have no doubt they will get it sorted but I’m thinking that we’re going to have to wait for Zen 4+ for that.

I’m thinking this is AMD’s Ice Lake moment..

Milian X is already rumored. So its possible that early 7K is only going to be around for a year until the yields improve then they release Zen 4 with 3D V-Cache.
 
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16 "real cores" should be very good for production work. Intel is going to need a shit load of e-cores to compete with that.

In terms of gaming, this thing's biggest competition is going to be their own 5800X3D. If I were them, I would lock that sucker down to something ridiculous like 4.5GHz to make sure it doesn't beat the new chip in gaming. Oh wait a minute...
 

exlink

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Is the 15% uplift clock for clock? Or because they are hitting 5Ghz?
Hopefully its clock for clock. And if they can hit 5Ghz thats really good parity with Intel.

The pcie lanes will be the deciding factor for me next time i upgrade (still probably 4 years off). The 5800 being limited to 20 was why I had to change course last rebuild and go Intel.
If it was clock for clock they would’ve indicated +15% IPC and not single thread. The +15% more than likely includes IPC improvements and the higher frequencies.
 

jobert

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Factoring in the much higher clocks and ddr5 being used it appears there's just a few percent IPC increase so all of these YouTube rumors have been complete BS no matter how good they claim their sources were. The 5800x3d could still end up being the faster gaming CPU in some cases..
 

tom_ozahoski

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Factoring in the much higher clocks and ddr5 being used it appears there's just a few percent IPC increase so all of these YouTube rumors have been complete BS no matter how good they claim their sources were. The 5800x3d could still end up being the faster gaming CPU in some cases..
I doubt the 5800x3d will game any faster with a ghz slower clock speed.

I do agree though about IPC. 15% higher clocks for 15% higher performance
 

chameleoneel

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I doubt the 5800x3d will game any faster with a ghz slower clock speed.

I do agree though about IPC. 15% higher clocks for 15% higher performance
Yeah I don't think the 5800X3D will be faster. But, based on how it competes with the 12900KS with DDR5 6400 ----- 5800X3D will likely be competitive with Zen4, if not more/less the same, in games which like the extra cache.
But, there are games like Hitman 3 or Cyberpunk, which like clockspeed and IPC. Alder Lake dominates. Even with DDR4.
 

jobert

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I mean you people can do math right? Again 15% increase means the 5800 x3d would still be faster in some gaming cases. If you're still having trouble comprehending that then go look at some of the gaming benchmarks and you will see that the 5800 x3d is indeed sometimes over 15% faster than the 5800 x.
 
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LukeTbk

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IF I understand that it will be DDR5 only (did I understood that correctly ?) did sound to me like a big issue, but pricing could be somewhat ok by launch time, is there good 32 gig kit ddr5- under $250 USD with tax ?

Total package cost could loose quite a bit to a ddr4 next gen Intel CPU in the low end/mid range.

24 PCIe 5.0 slots sound like a lot, that 48 PCIe 4.0 bandwith or 96 PCIe 3.0, that sound like bandwith of not so long ago HEDT level platform I think and 55% of a threadripper 3960x.

Will see how long it will take for anything regular user PCI-E 5.0 to change anything to 4.0 at least bandwith wise.
 
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Camberwell

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I mean you people can do math right? Again 15% increase means the 5800 x3d would still be faster in some gaming cases. If you're still having trouble comprehending that then go look at some of the gaming benchmarks and you will see that the 5800 x3d is indeed sometimes over 15% faster than the 5800 x.
True, but not worth the 35% increase in cost over the 5800X (where I live at least)...
 

Teenyman45

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was just aboot to post that, so ill post gn's overview. some good stuff coming and i like that they carried over the heatsink mount.



So do I. Late last year I bought a Techn AM4 cpu block expecting to get a 5900X3D or a 5950X3D. Since those were never released, I decided to wait for AM5.
 

LukeTbk

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If all the video card rumors are also false and the next gen is a much lower than usual performance upgrade, that would be quite the deception, I think.
 

toast0

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IF I understand that it will be DDR5 only (did I understood that correctly ?) did sound to me like a big issue, but pricing could be somewhat ok by launch time, is there good 32 gig kit ddr5- under $250 USD with tax ?
Yeah, all indications are DDR5 only for AM5. If this launches in Fall like the slides say, that's not quite a year after Alder Lake; DDR5 will probably still be a bit spendy, but availability is good now (but that could change, of course), and prices have fallen a lot since the start of the year. I guess we'll see, but I think by the time this is actually out, it will probably be the right decision to do DDR5 only. If not, maybe release a 5900X3D as a last hurrah for the DDR4 performance crowd; and quietly push Zen3 for the value crowd, maybe make 5300G available to retail buyers.
 

chameleoneel

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I mean you people can do math right? Again 15% increase means the 5800 x3d would still be faster in some gaming cases. If you're still having trouble comprehending that then go look at some of the gaming benchmarks and you will see that the 5800 x3d is indeed sometimes over 15% faster than the 5800 x.
Its not a flat 15 for AM4. AMD says over 15% and there wasn't any of the usual showing of the weakspots. To me, that means that its at least 15% in most of the worst cases. They also only talked about upping cache for a section of cache which people don't normally buzz about. Which means they probably have something later to announce on L3 cache, as well.

Also, this is probably less likely but----they could very well release a CPU with more than 16 cores. Remember when Zen 2 launched, they only showed off the 3900x, at first.
 

LukeTbk

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t will probably be the right decision to do DDR5 only.
Probably, we are not much of a price fall away on the ram kit to make not having the complexity/cost/worst DDR 5 controller worth it, specially if launch is just mid high end.

The 13100k/13400k DDR4 platform could be significantly better perf/$ than the equivalent performance on AMD side, if the pricing does not change drastically too (but if we follow recent time, those could take a while before being launched).

We are a point that a large segment of performance can be filled with the giant AM4 offer that will continue to exist for a long time and obviously AM5 is there for the long run, which would make the DDR4 support in 3-4 year's be just a dead weight.
 
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jobert

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Its not a flat 15 for AM4. AMD says over 15% and there wasn't any of the usual showing of the weakspots. To me, that means that its at least 15% in most of the worst cases. They also only talked about upping cache for a section of cache which people don't normally buzz about. Which means they probably have something later to announce on L3 cache, as well.

Also, this is probably less likely but----they could very well release a CPU with more than 16 cores. Remember when Zen 2 launched, they only showed off the 3900x, at first.
Well there are cases where the 5800 x 3D is well over 15% faster than the standard 5800x. There are a few cases where it's even over 20 to 25% faster so again it appears there will be cases where the 5800 x3d could be faster than Zen 4 in some games. And having more cores than 16 would be irrelevant for gaming.
 

KazeoHin

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In terms of gaming, this thing's biggest competition is going to be their own 5800X3D. If I were them, I would lock that sucker down to something ridiculous like 4.5GHz to make sure it doesn't beat the new chip in gaming. Oh wait a minute...

Bingo. This is something I've been speculating about since it's launch
 

chameleoneel

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Well there are cases where the 5800 x 3D is well over 15% faster than the standard 5800x. There are a few cases where it's even over 20 to 25% faster so again it appears there will be cases where the 5800 x3d could be faster than Zen 4 in some games. And having more cores than 16 would be irrelevant for gaming.
The point about the core counts, is that AMD seems to be obscuring their hand. And I'm willing to bet core counts might be included in what they are hiding.
 

LukeTbk

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The point about the core counts, is that AMD seems to be obscuring their hand. And I'm willing to bet core counts might be included in what they are hiding.
A higher than 16 core could exist, but would probably be a slower gaming chips no ?

Not sure to follow the conversation, someone is just speculating that for a list of title, 5800x3d has a shot to be has fast as 7xxx, if not faster on their launch, higher core count or not worth the 35% increase in cost over the 5800X (where I live at least)... change nothing to that statement.
 

T_A

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People complaining Zen4 CPUs wont be fast enough , while im sitting here wanting to finally update and loving that its a new platform that will be 3-4 years future proof at least.
also , 5800X3D is not the fastest AMD you can get , it really shines in games and similar usage , but for productively the lower freqs. really hurt it vs 5900x or 5950x (and its still too hot to up the freqs on that gen)
 

Lakados

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Still hoping it returns as yields improve and the market settles down.
It’s not about yields it’s about shortening the supply lines. The Threadripper non Pro’s used a different controller and different core than the Epyc and the Ryzen, now the Threadripper Pro’s are just differently packaged EPYC’s.far fewer parts to produce, AMD is going to be in the position for many more years where they sell 100% of what they make and that’s good for AMD but to maximize their profits in that case they have to chase yields and margins and the non Pro Threadripper parts mess that up. Quite simply those Threadripper’s are bad for their stock prices.
 
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