3870 X2 Sucks in older games

neubspeed

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Feb 19, 2005
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518
So I just installed my new 3870 X2 (for those of you haters, there's a 30 day return policy which overlaps with the 9800GX2 launch hehehe) and performance is what I expected in newer games (maxing out UT3, CoD4, etc. etc... Crysis with everything high except shadows @ 1920x1200)...

BUT, the performance is atrocious and brutal in some of my older favourite games such as TrackMania United and Need For Speed Most Wanted. The card was chugging and textures were flashing. I couldn't even get 2xAA at my native resolution. I was able to completely max out these games on my 8800GT.

Is there something I'm missing? Is this card not capable of playing older games?
 

Simpson5774

2[H]4U
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Feb 1, 2005
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Crossfire can only get you so far, the 3870x2 is crossfire on a card. the '9800GX2' is SLi on a card.
 

Citizen86

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I'd say maybe they don't support Crossfire. That's actually a little interesting, because if it's a Crossfire issue, and you have no way to disable Crossfire since it's all done internally... you could be rather screwed. :eek:
 

Rock&Roll

[H]ard|Gawd
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Wow. I bust out the Trackmania United pretty frequently. So I'm glad I'm passed on the who dual-card thing.
 

R1ckCa1n

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Since you went from a NV card to AMD I suggest a clean installation of your OS before making judgement. I had one hell of a time getting my 3870's to run right when moving from a 8800GTS.
 

neubspeed

Gawd
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Feb 19, 2005
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Hmmmn, I'm using XP 32-bit right now.

R1ckCa1n, do you really think that would make such a big difference? If that's the case I can get a copy of XP or Vista and put it on this weekend. Also, is it worth doing Vista? I really hated how slow it made my computer last time I had it on.
 

rennyf77

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I'd say maybe they don't support Crossfire. That's actually a little interesting, because if it's a Crossfire issue, and you have no way to disable Crossfire since it's all done internally... you could be rather screwed. :eek:

typically, games don't 'support' cf or sli. its up to the drivers to do the work. crysis is the only game i've ever heard of that had to be patched for multi gpu to work.
 

Mr. Bluntman

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I don't think there is a way to. Try disabling Catalyst AI in the CCC. I THINK that MIGHT disables the onboard crossfire.

Unfortunately with the Radeon 3870X2, the card's internal crossfire is handled by the internal PCIe bridge chip and it cannot be disabled though drivers, AFAIK.
 

Citizen86

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typically, games don't 'support' cf or sli. its up to the drivers to do the work. crysis is the only game i've ever heard of that had to be patched for multi gpu to work.

I think drivers are a big part, but obviously, not just with Crysis as an example, it seems like the actual game needs to have some sort of multi-card ability written into it also. Like Lost Planet, there is an in-game option for Multi-video card. If he's playing an older game that doesn't support it (which obviously means there wouldn't be driver support either), then it's not going to work properly, and he's going to get those unsteady framerates/missing textures, etc.
 

MrGuvernment

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^^ sure, because only the newer cat's driver made the card work properly....

oh no, sorry that was using 2 x X2's new drivers made that work.
 

nissanztt90

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Apr 13, 2007
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3,858
If you play old games, then you should not be buying X2

He clearly plays newer games, if you read the post. That excuse is lame as shit, i play new games, and plenty of old games, and a 450 dollar GPU should handle them fine no problem. Hes obviously got a driver issue, not an issue with his GPU decision. Thanks for contributing 0 to this thread.

OP: Definitely try wiping the OS first and reinstall. It definitely possible that those games dont like Crossfire, lower FPS with Crossfire enable is not uncommon in older games, but it shouldnt be chugging, its usually slightly under what a single card would be.
 

rennyf77

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I think drivers are a big part, but obviously, not just with Crysis as an example, it seems like the actual game needs to have some sort of multi-card ability written into it also. Like Lost Planet, there is an in-game option for Multi-video card. If he's playing an older game that doesn't support it (which obviously means there wouldn't be driver support either), then it's not going to work properly, and he's going to get those unsteady framerates/missing textures, etc.

sure, which is why i wrote 'typically', but even in the games you mentioned, i still found multi gpu to work, they just worked a bit better when you flipped that switch in the game settings. this is purely conjecture on my part, but i think when multi gpu performance dips below single gpu performance, multi gpu is supposed to work, but the drivers are doing something else other than scaling performance.
 

Citizen86

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sure, which is why i wrote 'typically', but even in the games you mentioned, i still found multi gpu to work, they just worked a bit better when you flipped that switch in the game settings. this is purely conjecture on my part, but i think when multi gpu performance dips below single gpu performance, multi gpu is supposed to work, but the drivers are doing something else other than scaling performance.

Fair enough, I've never actually used a multi-GPU setup personally :D

But I'm not completely unsurprised that you could run into issues with older games and a brand new video card that has 2 GPU's on one board.
 

Citizen86

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i corrected myself in my own post but didnt delete it


the new catalyst drivers allowed someone to run 2 x X2 cards in crossfire, giving you quad Xfire.

Ah ok... I was reading it together and I didn't think it made much sense :p
 

astyler

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Mar 7, 2007
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before you go wiping your OS go for a clean installation of drivers. Run drivercleanerpro. It will purge old nvidia and ATI drivers, then install new ATI drivers from scratch. You shouldn't have to wipe your drive.
 

R1ckCa1n

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R1ckCa1n, do you really think that would make such a big difference? If that's the case I can get a copy of XP or Vista and put it on this weekend. Also, is it worth doing Vista? I really hated how slow it made my computer last time I had it on.

All I know if I tried driver cleaner and such with no luck. The only thing that made the card perform to my expectations was a fresh installation of the OS.
 

hamm3rhead

Gawd
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Jul 14, 2004
Messages
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So I just installed my new 3870 X2 (for those of you haters, there's a 30 day return policy which overlaps with the 9800GX2 launch hehehe) and performance is what I expected in newer games (maxing out UT3, CoD4, etc. etc... Crysis with everything high except shadows @ 1920x1200)...

BUT, the performance is atrocious and brutal in some of my older favourite games such as TrackMania United and Need For Speed Most Wanted. The card was chugging and textures were flashing. I couldn't even get 2xAA at my native resolution. I was able to completely max out these games on my 8800GT.

Is there something I'm missing? Is this card not capable of playing older games?

I'm having no problems with NFS: MW 1920x1080 all settings maxed (including aa) under cat 8.2 visiontek 3870x2. I don't have the other Trackmania game to try unfortunately.

I am unable to replicate any significant issues in games other then a flickering in WiC and there appears to be an AA bug during the death scene in tf2. I tried nailing up my aa in CCC and disabling in-game aa (suggested in another forum post) and that did fix the problem so it appears to be specific to in game aa only. I don't have alot of other older games installed.. Doom3 and Prey run perfect, RCT3 and Gothic3 are good as well.

Be glad to test anything else that people have trouble with and I happen to own.
 

Ogilvy

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typically, games don't 'support' cf or sli. its up to the drivers to do the work. crysis is the only game i've ever heard of that had to be patched for multi gpu to work.


If you call this working....SLi pulls less framerates in some situations. And only slightly more over a single 8800GT in other situations. And that's before the patch. After the patch, it barely picks up one FPS.


http://www.techspot.com/article/83-crysis-patch-performance-multigpu/


I've been looking to SLi again....I've also been considering the 3870 X2.

I think we're all going to have to wait for the 9800 GTX to see some real improvement in the modern DX10 titles.

Going from 130 to 180 fps in FEAR is not my idea of how SLi should scale.
 

dp0001

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Oct 3, 2006
Messages
103
this is my way of doing things...

create 30gb partition ( fastest gigs of the drive for OS)

install windows
install chipset drvs
install lan
install audio
(install whatever you feel like installing that doesn't need upgrading all the time)

image the drive

install videocard drivers

install games on other partition

so when new dvrs are out , all i have 2 do is dump the image (5min) and install new drivers - so fresh so clean!
games are still in other partition

voila my 2cents
phildabill ;)
 

Blackforge

Gawd
Joined
Nov 16, 2004
Messages
718
this is my way of doing things...

create 30gb partition ( fastest gigs of the drive for OS)

install windows
install chipset drvs
install lan
install audio
(install whatever you feel like installing that doesn't need upgrading all the time)

image the drive

install videocard drivers

install games on other partition

so when new dvrs are out , all i have 2 do is dump the image (5min) and install new drivers - so fresh so clean!
games are still in other partition

voila my 2cents
phildabill ;)

Just be aware that more and more games are storing their save games and settings under your Windows user profile.
 

kllrnohj

Supreme [H]ardness
Joined
Apr 1, 2003
Messages
6,845
Just be aware that more and more games are storing their save games and settings under your Windows user profile.

Which can be set up to be on the second partition - simply right-click on "My Documents" and change the target.
 

Blackforge

Gawd
Joined
Nov 16, 2004
Messages
718
Which can be set up to be on the second partition - simply right-click on "My Documents" and change the target.

Correct, however make sure to delete at least ntuser.dat when rebuilding as it can be the cause of problems with some applications, if corrupted. I usually recommend people try an alternate user account (so it builds a fresh profile) prior to uninstalling/reinstalling Apps/OS, just to see if the problem lies with just their account.
 

gtrajectory

Weaksauce
Joined
Feb 26, 2008
Messages
74
I'm having no problems with NFS: MW 1920x1080 all settings maxed (including aa) under cat 8.2 visiontek 3870x2. I don't have the other Trackmania game to try unfortunately.

I am unable to replicate any significant issues in games other then a flickering in WiC and there appears to be an AA bug during the death scene in tf2. I tried nailing up my aa in CCC and disabling in-game aa (suggested in another forum post) and that did fix the problem so it appears to be specific to in game aa only. I don't have alot of other older games installed.. Doom3 and Prey run perfect, RCT3 and Gothic3 are good as well.

Be glad to test anything else that people have trouble with and I happen to own.

PLEASE, could you test Quake 3 for a couple of hours in a row to see the card is 100% stable? I bought a 8800GT, and I had problems with Quake 3. It freezed at total random times (maybe it doesn't happen in 2 hours, but it happens in 5 minutes etc). The error after the 3 minutes freeze with stuttering sound was something about nvoglnt.dll. I tried EVERYTHING and then RMA'd it. I recieved it and the same shit is happening. I just give up with my theory being that nVidia is not going to support anymore old OpenGL games since Vista appeared, (nvoglnt.dll being the crashing module is extremly suspicious). Also, I remember I was able to play Crysis (and when it was 1.0) for 3 hours in a row without a single crash at very high settings (with that XP patch, since I use XP SP2, but Q3 would crash at Vista also, btw).

Also I've read at some places the 3870 X2 gets into trouble with older games, probably because of it being a multi GPU device, and that is scarying me to go now and buy it.

P.D: For some that said "if you want to play older games, don't but that card" just GTFO. I want to be able to play Crysis, but I also want to keep enjoying my Q3.

Thanks.
 

gtrajectory

Weaksauce
Joined
Feb 26, 2008
Messages
74
Can anyone answer ASAP? I have only 4 days remaining to make the change and I have to be sure it doesn't have a problem with Quake 3 since I play at tournaments.

Thanks.
 

Dospac

n00b
Joined
Feb 12, 2008
Messages
29
Dude, I don't even have my Q3 CD anymore. I suppose I could download it.. It's free now right?
 

Frag0Lution

Limp Gawd
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Nov 18, 2007
Messages
173
I have an X2, and I have no problems in games across the board. Running 8.3 Cat Drivers, but I do seem to have worked out past issues with a clean install.
 

gtrajectory

Weaksauce
Joined
Feb 26, 2008
Messages
74
I'll download and see what I can do with it. Doom3 and Prey play very well so I am guessing this will be fine. Or at least I haven't had OGL crashes or anything.

Thats awesome.

Play for a couple of hours in a row without minimizing or something, because my 8800gt could play well for 3 hours, but then you could experience the freezing in 5 minutes (TOTALLY random). I hope ATi doesn't have such problems with old openGL games.

Report ASAP and thanks.
 
Joined
Apr 10, 2007
Messages
609
Hey if you turn off CAT AI....Uncheck the box that shows Standard and advance video ..It will use one GPU:D

Also i like to run max settings AA/AF when playing older games Even TombRaider /Need4Speed and so on....Even @ 2300mhz and Phenom this 3870x2 Performs ..Setting performance modes in Cat and then use HIGHEST AA/AF and call it the day..I make shure the settings are forced , I dont use let application control with ATI or Nvidia..

Crysis never played or looked better even when i used my 6000+ and GTS at 950/2304/2250..This card just spanks it bad even when using just a 2300mhzCPU. Well at least for me it does..
 

Rare1

Limp Gawd
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Mar 20, 2006
Messages
242
before you go wiping your OS go for a clean installation of drivers. Run drivercleanerpro. It will purge old nvidia and ATI drivers, then install new ATI drivers from scratch. You shouldn't have to wipe your drive.

I concur!

I went from 8800GT to the X2. At first I just did a driver wipe, and reinstall. I was not impressed, and even had some trouble installing the ATI drivers (INF error).

I reinstalled with the new card in there, and now it is perfect.

My 3dmark06 score went up 3500 points after the new install.
 
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